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Think about it! Quite simply, does the UK have power to revoke a person's citizenship .... of another country! I think the answer to that question should be quite obvious.Hence, your passport of your country becomes null and void pending new documents being issued by your host country.
Although if a "refugee" still manages to use the passport of his old country, and worse still, visits his old country, then it's legitimate to question the bona fides of his refugee status.John wrote: If the Home Office has recognised that he is a refugee I am one am very pleased to welcome him to the UK, and I hope he has a long and prosperous life here. After all, that is surely what it is all about .... civilised countries granting protection from those whose life is in danger. (As compared to those that are merely economic migrants pretending to be refugees.)
Well, you are a refugee mostly because of circumstances out of one's control. War refugees, for example, do not want to NOT be a citizen of their country, but are forced to flee. There is no international mandate that says you should denounce your citizenship for any reason (unless country governments do not allow or recognise dual nationality). But in this case, the guy isn't even a BC yet, so if he was to denounce his citizenship, he'd be stateless.nicgentile wrote:Ideally, I thought being a refugee, you denounced your citizenship. Hence by doing that your passport would be void. In this guy's letter from the HO, its written that he has been granted Indefinite Leave to enter or remain in the United Kingdom as a refugee. Its endorsed on his passport. I was just curious. Doesn't exactly bother me, just curious.
No, as noted above, the UK is not able to revoke a citizenship of another country that someone may hold.nicgentile wrote:I always thought that when you became a refugee, you forsake the citizenship of your country. Hence, your passport of your country becomes null and void pending new documents being issued by your host country.
There is also an argument that the UK government purposely slows down applicants requests for asylum in the hope that by the time the asylum application is processed the applicant's country of origin is suitably stable (at least as far as the UK government is concerned) for the asylum application to be denied.Having said that, though, situations do change with time, and countries that were once unstable and where once a person might have been in danger do, sometimes, regain a degree of stability. (Rwanda is one obvious case in point.) These sorts of changes over time are likely to be relevant quite often, given the lamentable delays in the Home Office dealing with aysum claims, certainly during the late 1990s and early 2000s.
Are the delays deliberate or merely due to incompetence? Perhaps we shall never know...Dawie wrote:There is also an argument that the UK government purposely slows down applicants requests for asylum in the hope that by the time the asylum application is processed the applicant's country of origin is suitably stable (at least as far as the UK government is concerned) for the asylum application to be denied.
John wrote: If the Home Office has recognised that he is a refugee I for one am very pleased to welcome him to the UK, and I hope he has a long and prosperous life here. After all, that is surely what it is all about .... civilised countries granting protection from those whose life is in danger. (As compared to those that are merely economic migrants pretending to be refugees.)
Yes, there could be no legal objection to that from the British point of view. Of course, if the person has left the country of origin because it was unsafe, it might be dangerous to do so, but that's a different point. And, as noted above, the situation in the country of origin might well have improved or stabilised by the time that happens.peppa p wrote:can one then travel back to their country if they have been a refugee and been granted BC and travelling on a british passport
Yes but Britain won't be able to help you if the authorities of that country claim you as a citizen still and try to prevent you from leaving, or something.peppa p wrote:can one then travel back to their country if they have been a refugee and been granted BC and travelling on a british passport
I have always wondered why people do not claim refugee status in their first country of call if they are indeed fleeing persecution. Since the idea is to escape their home countries to a safe country.JAJ wrote:Considering that many "refugees" in Britain have arrived from safe countries like France, it is legitimate to question how "genuine" they were in the first place.adindas wrote:I fully agree with this statement. Genuine refugees are people who flee from death sentence, torture, etc.
That last question a very good one. Ask five different people and you'd get five different answers, of course. My suspicion is that the attraction of the UK for refugees, over (apparently) many or most other countries in Europe, is multifactorial but is in part (and for different people in differing degrees) related to at least some of the following:jes2jes wrote:I have always wondered why people do not claim refugee status in their first country of call if they are indeed fleeing persecution. Since the idea is to escape their home countries to a safe country.JAJ wrote:Considering that many "refugees" in Britain have arrived from safe countries like France, it is legitimate to question how "genuine" they were in the first place.adindas wrote:I fully agree with this statement. Genuine refugees are people who flee from death sentence, torture, etc.
Is life better in the UK than France, Ireland, Germany, Holland etc? I do not know but someone might know.
Nice piece but all these pops another question in my mind. If you flee country A to country B, how would you possibly cross borders without a visa or a passport? If suppose you flee from Iraq into Iran, Jordan, Syria or any Middle Eastern Country, don't you need any travel document (plus entry clearance) of some sort before an airline allows you to board to your destination in the first place?Christophe wrote:That last question a very good one. Ask five different people and you'd get five different answers, of course. My suspicion is that the attraction of the UK for refugees, over (apparently) many or most other countries in Europe, is multifactorial but is in part (and for different people in differing degrees) related to at least some of the following:jes2jes wrote:I have always wondered why people do not claim refugee status in their first country of call if they are indeed fleeing persecution. Since the idea is to escape their home countries to a safe country.JAJ wrote:Considering that many "refugees" in Britain have arrived from safe countries like France, it is legitimate to question how "genuine" they were in the first place.adindas wrote:I fully agree with this statement. Genuine refugees are people who flee from death sentence, torture, etc.
Is life better in the UK than France, Ireland, Germany, Holland etc? I do not know but someone might know.
- - history (real and perceived): the UK, England in particular, has (and/or is seen as having) a long history of welcoming disparate people and has a reputation (reasonable enough, I think) of genuine tolerance, certainly compared with most other countries of the world
- the worldwide primacy of the English language
- a recent history of relative economic success
- wide (sometimes historical) connections in much of the rest of the world, particularly relevant for countries that were once in the British Empire (and are now, usually, in the Commonwealth), such that British institutions, systems etc have some degree of familiarity to many people that the institutions of many other countries do not have
- a belief, possibly erroneous and presumably of most interest to people who are planning to "milk" the system, that the UK has benefits that are either more generous or else easier to access than those of other countries
- the fact that Great Britain is an island: this is, I believe, something subconscious that can affect the thinking of people who are genuinely fleeing from strife or persecution - it gives an added feeling of safety to be further separated by the sea from the place of the troubles, which is usually on the great Eurasian-African land mass; as I say, this is subconscious and probably illogical in an era when most international travel is by air anyway, but I believe it is real nonetheless for some genuine asylum seekers
JAJ wrote:Considering that many "refugees" in Britain have arrived from safe countries like France, it is legitimate to question how "genuine" they were in the first place.adindas wrote:I fully agree with this statement. Genuine refugees are people who flee from death sentence, torture, etc.
I think it's reasonable that people might be fleeing persecution but also have a preferred destination. They may have family members in the UK who have already fled, make speak some English but not French, etcjes2jes wrote: I have always wondered why people do not claim refugee status in their first country of call if they are indeed fleeing persecution. Since the idea is to escape their home countries to a safe country.
Is life better in the UK than France, Ireland, Germany, Holland etc? I do not know but someone might know.
avjones wrote: I think it's reasonable that people might be fleeing persecution but also have a preferred destination. They may have family members in the UK who have already fled, make speak some English but not French, etc
The Refugee Convention does not give those fleeing persecution the right to select a permanent migration outcome to a favoured destination.avjones wrote: I think it's reasonable that people might be fleeing persecution but also have a preferred destination. They may have family members in the UK who have already fled, make speak some English but not French, etc
jes2jes wrote:I have always wondered why people do not claim refugee status in their first country of call if they are indeed fleeing persecution. Since the idea is to escape their home countries to a safe country.JAJ wrote:Considering that many "refugees" in Britain have arrived from safe countries like France, it is legitimate to question how "genuine" they were in the first place.adindas wrote:I fully agree with this statement. Genuine refugees are people who flee from death sentence, torture, etc.
Is life better in the UK than France, Ireland, Germany, Holland etc? I do not know but someone might know.
If you are really are a refugee, the first thing on your mind would not be integration and language, but rather safety, shelter and food and to distant yourself from danger. It does not matter whether the people speak Greek, Italian, Latin or English in your first country of safety. That is secondary. I believe this would kick in later after you have been granted the right to travel after your status is approved, then you can decide on a place where you would fit as far as integration is concern.If I was a refugee, which I am not, and I was fleeing a country and let's say may first country of safety was Greece, I would find it difficult to communicate and therefore also hindering my integration into that society
Sounds like you have some visa envynicgentile wrote:I was speaking to a couple of guys. One guy is a refugee from Ethiopia, the others from Sudan.
The main issue was that this guy came here on his passport, (Ethiopian) thru a visitors visa, claimed amnesty and was granted a letter saying his refugee status had been recognized, and bam ILR in his passport soon after. All this is the span of one year six months. Never been in the UK before, now he has Indefinite Leave to remain, a business and a better lifestyle than most of us.
I always thought that when you became a refugee, you forsake the citizenship of your country. Hence, your passport of your country becomes null and void pending new documents being issued by your host country.
avjones wrote:If a person has claimed asylum in another EU country, and then comes to the UK and claims, they will be sent back under the Dublin Convention.