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New Irish case reported by the Irish times

Forum to discuss all things Blarney | Ireland immigration

Moderators: Casa, Amber, archigabe, batleykhan, ca.funke, ChetanOjha, EUsmileWEallsmile, JAJ, John, Obie, push, geriatrix, vinny, CR001, zimba, meself2, Administrator

Obie
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Posts: 15163
Joined: Tue Apr 21, 2009 1:06 am
Location: UK/Ireland
Ireland

Post by Obie » Fri Nov 18, 2011 3:11 pm

Well i am not sure what you are talking about, in UK courts, a reported case is considered binding upon a lower court, but an unreported case like the one mentioned above, can be persuasive but certainly not binding.

There is a clear distinction between binding and persuasive.

Before a case is reported in the UK, permission has to be given by a Senior Judge or the president of the Upper Tribunal, and in most cases there has to be more than two judges including at least one Senior Judge.

If a Case is reported, then the intention is that it could be used as a binding authority.
Smooth seas do not make skilful sailors

walrusgumble
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Location: ireland

Post by walrusgumble » Fri Nov 18, 2011 5:46 pm

Obie wrote:Well i am not sure what you are talking about, in UK courts, a reported case is considered binding upon a lower court, but an unreported case like the one mentioned above, can be persuasive but certainly not binding.

There is a clear distinction between binding and persuasive.

Before a case is reported in the UK, permission has to be given by a Senior Judge or the president of the Upper Tribunal, and in most cases there has to be more than two judges including at least one Senior Judge.


If a Case is reported, then the intention is that it could be used as a binding authority.
TO make clear, I did not nor do I for one milisecond suggest that a decision from the lower courts like Tribunal , ever could binding the Superior Courts.

Reported and Unreported refer to their recording into authoritativeness law reports. It has nothing to do with the Hierarchy of courts. Obviously, a judgement of the superior court is binding on lower courts, and even unreported can be binding, its not prohibited.

You obviously seek for the most authoritativeness case. Look for instance the current case law. When its cites precedent, it nearly always refers to the most recent cases that affirmed the statement of law, it will rarely refer to the very very very first case that ruled on a principle or statement of law. Why? Making sure that the legal principle is still in tact after all of these years. Of Course you would prefer to have a favourable reported case as oppose to unreported, but its not always the case.

The simple fact that a judgment comes from the Tribunal , a lower court, will not be binding on the higher courts. That is all that you need to say, and say, the superior courts have ruled on this. I take it you got the above from links like, http://denning.law.ox.ac.uk/lrsp/overvi ... eports.php

There was no need to utter the words Reported or Unreported. Simply say, the Superior Courts , a case that you provided, says this.


Going off track,
How do you know that this is an unreported judgment? It may have being reported and published in the specialist ed Law Reports. There is an Immigration Law Report available.


Here is a proper definition of reported and unreported
http://www.ics.heacademy.ac.uk/resource ... age_04.htm
In fact, unreported cases are now often full written judgments.Ex tempore judgments (off the cuff judgments) don't have great value because it is far to short to determine is value. The case about is not an ex tempore.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_report

Collection of written judgments especially unreported ones, are highly valued by lawyers because it may help a case , but they are harder to find. If it relates to a case, there is nothing stopping a Judge from approving of it.
p://www.kent.ac.uk/lawlinks/researching-the ... selaw.html
http://denning.law.ox.ac.uk/lrsp/overvi ... eports.php


http://denning.law.ox.ac.uk/lrsp/overvi ... eports.php

Greenie
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Posts: 7374
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United Kingdom

Post by Greenie » Fri Nov 18, 2011 6:32 pm

walrusgumble wrote:
Obie wrote:Well i am not sure what you are talking about, in UK courts, a reported case is considered binding upon a lower court, but an unreported case like the one mentioned above, can be persuasive but certainly not binding.

There is a clear distinction between binding and persuasive.

Before a case is reported in the UK, permission has to be given by a Senior Judge or the president of the Upper Tribunal, and in most cases there has to be more than two judges including at least one Senior Judge.


If a Case is reported, then the intention is that it could be used as a binding authority.
TO make clear, I did not nor do I for one milisecond suggest that a decision from the lower courts like Tribunal , ever could binding the Superior Courts.

Reported and Unreported refer to their recording into authoritativeness law reports. It has nothing to do with the Hierarchy of courts. Obviously, a judgement of the superior court is binding on lower courts, and even unreported can be binding, its not prohibited.

You obviously seek for the most authoritativeness case. Look for instance the current case law. When its cites precedent, it nearly always refers to the most recent cases that affirmed the statement of law, it will rarely refer to the very very very first case that ruled on a principle or statement of law. Why? Making sure that the legal principle is still in tact after all of these years. Of Course you would prefer to have a favourable reported case as oppose to unreported, but its not always the case.

The simple fact that a judgment comes from the Tribunal , a lower court, will not be binding on the higher courts. That is all that you need to say, and say, the superior courts have ruled on this. I take it you got the above from links like, http://denning.law.ox.ac.uk/lrsp/overvi ... eports.php

There was no need to utter the words Reported or Unreported. Simply say, the Superior Courts , a case that you provided, says this.


Going off track,
How do you know that this is an unreported judgment? It may have being reported and published in the specialist ed Law Reports. There is an Immigration Law Report available.


Here is a proper definition of reported and unreported
http://www.ics.heacademy.ac.uk/resource ... age_04.htm
In fact, unreported cases are now often full written judgments.Ex tempore judgments (off the cuff judgments) don't have great value because it is far to short to determine is value. The case about is not an ex tempore.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_report

Collection of written judgments especially unreported ones, are highly valued by lawyers because it may help a case , but they are harder to find. If it relates to a case, there is nothing stopping a Judge from approving of it.
p://www.kent.ac.uk/lawlinks/researching-the ... selaw.html
http://denning.law.ox.ac.uk/lrsp/overvi ... eports.php


http://denning.law.ox.ac.uk/lrsp/overvi ... eports.php

Obie is correct.

Determinations from the First Tier and Upper Tribunal (Immigration and Asylum Chamber) are only reported in certain circumstances. Being reported in the context of Tribunal determinations refers to the determinations be published on the Tribunal website, not whether they appear in law reports.

See http://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/f ... mmigration

You will note that:

Only determinations in which the jurisdiction of the Tribunal was exercised
by the Senior President, the Chamber President or an Upper Tribunal judge is
reportable and hence not all determinations are published on the website.
In practice 'reported' determinations are selected by the IAC Reporting
Committee and published as soon as possible thereafter on the Tribunal's
case law database. The Legal Research Unit attempts to ensure that
decisions are only published once confirmation of service has been received.



If a Tribunal determination is 'unreported' it is not binding

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