Scenario: Lost passport abroad

[bluecole2]

Hi guys! SEASONS GREETINGS to you all.

I was looking through UK high commission's website in Nigeria and notice they are no information on what to do in the event you loose your non EU-passport and what to return to UK.

Here is a scenario; As a non EU family member of an EU- national with a residence card back in home country (Nigeria) for a couple of weeks and lost my passport.

1, What will I have to provide in order to return back to family and work in UK? I understand i should be able to fly back to UK with a passport according to directive 38 ec... but as things currently stands can I return with just a passport? If not;

a, Do I have to apply for eea family permit or any form of visa or residence card?

b, Since i'm not residing in my home country what sort of requirement will I have to fulfil?

c, In the event I don't have any money or can't get any on time, what help are available to non eea family member residence in UK?

Your comments advises we be well appreciated as always.

Thanks

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

I have no personal experience of this.

Did you keep a copy of any of the documenation? I suppose your residence card was in the passport.

I imagine that what will be expected is that you (1) obtain a new passport and (2) apply for a family permit. You will most likely need to demonstrate that your EU family member is exercising treaty rights in the UK (very similar to what you did to get the residence card in the first instance).

I would try and contact the consulate if I were you and confirm what they will require of you.

[Directive/2004/38/EC]

Exactly what EU smile says:
(1) Get a new passport
(2) Apply for an EEA Family Permit
(3) Fly home
(4) When in the UK apply for a Residence Card

I can't remember what the EU citizen is doing in your case and for how long they have been doing it. But this is the general outline.

[Hubba]

I have no personal experience of this.

Did you keep a copy of any of the documenation? I suppose your residence card was in the passport.

I imagine that what will be expected is that you (1) obtain a new passport and (2) apply for a family permit. You will most likely need to demonstrate that your EU family member is exercising treaty rights in the UK (very similar to what you did to get the residence card in the first instance).

I would try and contact the consulate if I were you and confirm what they will require of you.

You know, this is one of my biggest concerns. My wife (the EEA national) is exercising Treaty Rights as self-sufficient, through my employment. Just the fact that I would have lost my passport with the vignette shouldn't require the whole process to be done again.To apply for a Family Permit abroad is just madness, given that all my personal documentation is here in the UK. I'm a national from a non-visa country, so I guess it would only be a hassle on the border. Of course, the HO must be reasonable on this kind of situation, but it is a bit frightening that there is no provision at all on their documentation regarding the evaluation of previously issued residence cards.

Does the HO ref. number present on the Residence Card have any value on border checks, if not presented together with the vignette?

[sheraz7]

Do you have atleast the ukba notification that they send while returning the passport after stamping the visa. That may work with your new passport.

[bluecole2]

Thanks for this responses guys,

I am in UK now, just planning ahead in the event such event occurs.

To have to apply for a family permit when already had been previously issued a RC card is absurd in my opinion.

There should be a quick and stressless provision to let a non-eea family member be able to return back to their families and job asap. Don't you agree?

What is the point of having an RC with ref number, pictures etc? if they can't provide a least a travel document notifying to airline and border office to let you through?

In the event one lost his/her job as a result of having to apply for sure entry visa. Who is likely to be responsible for the lost of employment?

Can you guys perhaps inform me what the provisions are for those who had ILR in the same scenario


Thanks

[sheraz7]

So you are already in uk. But how you already know your passport will be lost and why you want to loose your passport.

[Hubba]

So you are already in uk. But how you already know your passport will be lost and why you want to loose your passport.

This is a hypothetical situation. One that people who often travels abroad, such as myself, always have in the back of their minds.

[sheraz7]

Everybody travel abroad often or less often and then in compliance of that fact why not the holder give its top priority to keep its passport safe to avoid any inconvenience.

[Directive/2004/38/EC]

I think it is an issue that everyone might face, but it a bit of a waste to think about it too much right now.

If you loose your passport abroad, first priority is to get a replacement. Proving who you are, and that you are the right person to give the passport to.

You may or may not then be required to get replacement visas. Same thing: proving who you are and that you are the right person to give the visa to.

In general the visa should be straight forward. UKBA already has a file on you and has a copy of your finger prints. You might be required to show that your spouse continues to work and live in the UK, or might not.

Best is to scan all your important documents, creating an encrypted PDF file. Store this somewhere you can get access to it, like your email. You are likely to find this useful if you need to apply for any of these replacements.

[Obie]

Unfortunately OP, the residence card cannot be replaced, it is simply a confirmation of ones right. Therefore each time you seek this confirmation, you need to make a new application and provide the necessary proof. Furthermore, this confirmation cannot be applied for from overseas.

In your case, EEA family permit will be required and on entry to the UK reapply for Residence Card. This is provided for in Regulation 12.

Regulation 12 also makes provision for people who retain their right of residence and in your position to apply for EEA family permit also.

[Jambo]

Can you guys perhaps inform me what the provisions are for those who had ILR in the same scenario

If it makes you feel better, people under the immigration rules (TLTR/ILR) also need to go through the same process (i.e. apply for entry clearance from the consulate abroad).

(This is all true if you are a visa national. If you are a non visa national, you can normally sort it out at the border).

[Obie]

I also thought leave to remain is transferable. Therefore people overseas in ops position simply need to get a new passport and receive their endorsement.

[Jambo]

I also thought leave to remain is transferable. Therefore people overseas in ops position simply need to get a new passport and receive their endorsement.

True but I believe you can only apply for the transfer within the UK so you still got the burden of getting to the border (which if you are a visa national means getting an entry clearance).

In the UK, the transfer of a visa/ILR is quicker than getting a new document under the EEA regulations but so are the normal applications under the immigration rules (PEO or postal). At least the EEA applications are free and you can always ask for your passport back.

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

Thanks for this responses guys,

I am in UK now, just planning ahead in the event such event occurs.

To have to apply for a family permit when already had been previously issued a RC card is absurd in my opinion.

There should be a quick and stressless provision to let a non-eea family member be able to return back to their families and job asap. Don't you agree?

What is the point of having an RC with ref number, pictures etc? if they can't provide a least a travel document notifying to airline and border office to let you through?

In the event one lost his/her job as a result of having to apply for sure entry visa. Who is likely to be responsible for the lost of employment?

Can you guys perhaps inform me what the provisions are for those who had ILR in the same scenario


Thanks

Keep your passport safe. It is very important. It is for the holder's use only.

[Directive/2004/38/EC]

A friend's husband, who is originally from Ghana, was visiting the Netherlands from Germany. Somebody smashed his car window and stole his briefcase which was unfortunately visible in the car. In it was his passport with important multiple entry visas and the equivalent of a PR stamp. Replacing all of this would have taken months, and been very problematic as he was a management consultant and was constantly travelling for work.

So he decided to buy back his passport. He knew he had to move fast. He spent the next day putting word out that he would pay a large sum of money to get back his passport. And managed to buy it back! I do not remember how much he paid, but I think it was not cheap.

This is another option for a stolen passport.

[sheraz7]

EUsmileWEallsmile Says:

It is for the holder's use only.

These words said by EUsmileWEallsmile are best ones to summarize this conversation.

[Hubba]

EUsmileWEallsmile Says:

It is for the holder's use only.

These words said by EUsmileWEallsmile are best ones to summarize this conversation.

I doubt that this was the original concern of the OP, though. I often travel to countries which, unfortunately, are not safe. Hell, I'm afraid of being robbed between the airport and the hotel when I'm in such countries (which unfortunately has happened before whilst I was leaving in such country).

Of course the passport is for the holder's use only, that's implicit. But what worries me is specifically being robbed whilst abroad and having my passport taken. Unfortunately, it wouldn't be easy as it was for Directive/2004/38/EC's friend to buy it back (which is also a bit of an absurd, but I see the point). Just to think on the bothering such situation would bring me gives me the chills.

So I guess you guys should back off a bit on the judgement before exposing your opinions. The OP has a valid concern, although one you may not share.

[sheraz7]

@Hubba
Everybody has made really interesting contribution over this thread and how can you say that op has a valid concern despite the fact firstly he built the situation that he lost his passport in nigeria and then subsequently he said that he is in uk but just need advise as what need to do if this event happen. Is that a valid concern or does it really deserve to be called as valid.

[Obie]

As much as i respect the common sense view expressed by EUsmileWEallsmile, it is important to note that people don't always set out to loose their travel documents overseas, they are not always careless infact. Some fall victims of criminal gangs, and lots more.

I beleive to punish further, someone, who was possibly held at gun point , and had his passport stolen, or there was a fire, or even due to a bit of carelessness, is in my view wrong.

Provision has to be made to deal with these issues, expeditiously, whatever the circumstances.

[sheraz7]

@obie.
We wish your opinion the policy maker listen but it is really impossible based on the sense that nobody else except an individual itself responsible to take care its personal belongings. Moreover, european legislation will never intervene over the national/domestic security issue of the country where the rc holder being held on gun point (as you given example).

[Obie]

Well the whole point about free movement is that there should be no barrier to the exercise of it.

Whatever the circumstance, if an non-EEA national is faced with difficulties of returning, such as having to fill an EEA family permit application which is nearly 20 pages long, and contain lots of unnecessary question about financial means, that is a violation of community law.

No one is saying they should just issue documents like that, for sure there should be verification, but it has to be proportionate. These are people for whom UKBA has details and records on system. There can't be any justification for delays.

Up until a year ago, there was no provision, for Ex-family members who retain their right of residence to obtain an EEa Family permit. If these people fall into any trouble and loose their documents overseas, then they are screwed, except they can afford the cost of Judicial Review to Challenge the SOS. This is surely not right.

[frei]

Obie's point seems to be as the most reasonable, it is just the case in Germany, I travelled and I lost my residence card although within the Schengen zone, luckily I had a letter confirming I have a right of residence valid for 5 years in Germany, so boarding a flight back to Germany was pretty straight forward really.

on arrival here it only took me a visit to the immigration office ( Auslanderbehorde) my finger print was retaken and I submitted a police report from the other Schengen country I was visiting, that was about it and I am sure if it were to happen in a 3rd country I would only need to notify the embassy and after proper check must have been carried out a visa would also be issued promptly at no cost.

I suppose it's the same directive that's still being enforced here, why has it been restrictively interpreted in the UK?

[Hubba]

@Hubba
Everybody has made really interesting contribution over this thread and how can you say that op has a valid concern despite the fact firstly he built the situation that he lost his passport in nigeria and then subsequently he said that he is in uk but just need advise as what need to do if this event happen. Is that a valid concern or does it really deserve to be called as valid.

Well, do you travel to 3rd. world countries with a certain frequency, at least to those with safety problems? I do. And it terrifies me even to think of having my passport stolen on these trips. So that's why I can judge the OP's concern as valid. I too live in the UK, for 4 and a half years now. My whole life is here, but I have folks abroad, living in places in which safety is a major concern (the local population is desensitised already). Me and my wife have already discussed contingency plans if we're mugged abroad whilst carrying our passports. But just to think of going through all this trouble if something happens is that worries me.

What I meant is that, as you have shown again on your comment, you're judging the OP's concern as if he was acting with bad intentions, whilst he's only overthinking a concern that, whilst it may seem very trivial or insignificant to you, is quite significant for him.

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

To clarify, passports are valuable and need to be treated as such. It is possible to obtain insurance against their loss (and consequent costs, but please read the small print). "Keep it secret, keep it safe" - to borrow a phrase from a film.