facial profiling a Heathrow experience

[Dawie]

Interesting article about the South African government's response to the recent report about how UK immigration officers are using facial profiling for admitting South Africans into the UK.

http://www.int.iol.co.za/index.php?set_ ... 621408B236

Interesting bit at the end about how Britain is now considering introducing visas for South African citizens. Even more interesting is South Africa's response to that.

London announced it was considering introducing a visa system.

South Africa said it would do the same if that happened, the SABC reported. - Sapa

[flyboy]

The South African government should do what the Brazilians are doing, that is impement visa reciprocity.

[Dawie]

I'm a firm believer in visa reciprocity, if only because it is fairer. Unfortunately, South Africa, like a lot of developing countries, does not apply visa reciprocity principles to 1st world countries, even though most of these countries require visas from South Africans.

[neil4u]

A few years ago coming back from Johannesburg to London Heathrow I was stopped by an immigration official going through the EU passport control on my British passport and was asked "What country have I come from?". I said South Africa and she let me through. I have always found it odd why she asked me that as I am a dual British/South African citizen and I should not be asked immigration questions?

[Rogerio]

The South African government should do what the Brazilians are doing, that is impement visa reciprocity.

Personally, I think this is a very silly Brazilian decision... Americans, for instance, with money to spend on holidays or on business trips avoid going to Brazil because they have to get a visa.... and then go spend their dosh elsewhere. I work for a huge American multinational, and know of countless situations where my US colleagues decided not to travel and carry their business over the phone due to visa requirements for US citizens.

The travel & tourism board of Brazil has been begging for our Ministry of Foreign Relations to intervene and change this policy for many years, to no avail.

I would rather swallow our (Brazilian) pride, stop the tit for tat attitude and get businesses in Brazil receiving that extra money.

I am not arguing that I agree with the US requiring visas for most, except for the visa waiver programme countries. I guess this topic has been debated many a time.

[Dawie]

Personally, I think this is a very silly Brazilian decision... Americans, for instance, with money to spend on holidays or on business trips avoid going to Brazil because they have to get a visa.... and then go spend their dosh elsewhere. I work for a huge American multinational, and know of countless situations where my US colleagues decided not to travel and carry their business over the phone due to visa requirements for US citizens.

What about Brazilians, with money to spend on holidays, who avoid going to America because of the visa requirement?

What's at stake, I suppose, is national pride. Why should an American just be able to waltz into any country they wish without having to get a visa, whereas most people around the world have to beg and plead to get a visa to enter America? Just so they can spend their money in our countries? No thanks, I'd rather them keep their money, and we can keep our pride.

[Administrator]

.

What about Brazilians, with money to spend on holidays, who avoid going to America because of the visa requirement?

Why should an American just be able to waltz into any country they wish without having to get a visa, whereas most people around the world have to beg and plead to get a visa to enter America? Just so they can spend their money in our countries?

http://www.iadb.org/mif/remittances/index.cfm

Not everyone who attempts to enter the U.S. (for one example) is a tourist ready to spend money.

The link above is one example of legal immigrants/migrants sending money out of the country (which is a perfectly acceptable and expected behavior). The illegal entrants send a vastly larger percentage out compared to their positive economic impact, and they largely violate tax laws in the process.

Visa waiver agreements are based upon treaties and upon the percentage of illegal over-stays and other violations from a country. The more people who violate immigration law, the more likely their country does not qualify for favored status.

In the case of the U.S., when more than 3% of nationals from a particular country violate immigration laws, that country is subject to visa requirements.

There are other factors, treaty, political and economic, but this is the baseline threshold golden rule. Countries that refuse to accept their illegal nationals back tend not to receive favorable treatment in negotiations, also.

No mystery about it.

The Admin

[joesoap101]

Everyone knows that this was happening. And seeing that South Africa champions 'fair' discrimination in the form of Affirmative Action, I think it is entirely fair that black South Africans are more likely to be stopped by UK immigration.

Keep in mind the following:
Unemployment rate for white South Africans 4.1%.
Unemployment rate for black South Africans 28.1%

Also if London were to introduce visas, the estimated 1 million British passport holders in SA will be very unhappy when their friends and relatives have to make a trip to South Africa House in London to obtain visas for South Africa!

[Dawie]

Also if London were to introduce visas, the estimated 1 million British passport holders in SA will be very unhappy when their friends and relatives have to make a trip to South Africa House in London to obtain visas for South Africa!

I personally would feel no sympathy whatsoever for the British should South Africa require visas from British citizens. Maybe they can taste a bit of their own medicine and see what it's like for people who have to come, cap in hand, to British embassies all over the world for a British visa.

I can just imagine the indignation though. "But I'm BRITISH!", they'll all shout and scream. "Can't you see the redness of my glorious passport? We have the right to do as we please and go where we want!"

[bbdivo]

I can just imagine the indignation though. "But I'm BRITISH!", they'll all shout and scream. "Can't you see the redness of my glorious passport? We have the right to do as we please and go where we want!"

And to think you could be one of those people soon!

[Dawie]

Exactly!