Surrinder Help please

[Ukgentle]

Okay long story short my gf is non EU we have been in a relationship online due to this situation for going on 3 years now. She has visited me in the UK 3 times during this period for a total of 4 months. It is far from the shakey relationship it sounds and very genuine. Doing this online for so long takes genuine commitment from both people. She is a well paid chef and I just can't find work in my industry anymore after a redundancy and considerable payscale drops due to the recession. I invested 10 years in what is now considered an unskilled profession as a printer assistant. We have considered marrying in Denmark this year and preparing to move to Ireland after I sell my house in the UK.

My question is will the durability of the relationship be an issue given we haven't lived together for 2 years. When I exercise my treaty rights will this be questioned or does being married bypass this issue. Anyone who really knows the answer I would greatly appreciate a response perhaps with reference to why this would not matter or some experience. My gf and I love each other very much. Her job is also on the shortage list for both the UK and Ireland. Problem in the UK is it doesn't meet the amount needed. In Ireland she would have to secure a job before traveling there. Any advice or ideas also would be golden. I have been worrying myself sleepless over this issues.

Thank you in advance

[357mag]

Being married should bypass the 2 years. Her having a job or not is irrelevant it is the EU partner who needs to get a job within 3 months.

[Ukgentle]

Thanks for the answer 357mag hoping a few others might chime in and if someone with legal experience could cite why or who to check this with even better.

Its a huge gamble for myself selling my home to do this but there's not much I wouldn't do to be with my gf. This situation is upsetting because I gave 10 years to an industry where now it leaves me with very little to show and could cost me years to correct in order to meet the cap allowance. I understand why the UKBA have the cap set but in my gf's situation its highly frustrating because shes in a shortage occupation and would only add to British society. I wish these situations were taken on a case by case level to the degree people offering skills the UK is in need of might get cut a bit of slack.

[Radconn]

Okay long story short my gf is non EU we have been in a relationship online due to this situation for going on 3 years now. She has visited me in the UK 3 times during this period for a total of 4 months. It is far from the shakey relationship it sounds and very genuine. Doing this online for so long takes genuine commitment from both people. She is a well paid chef and I just can't find work in my industry anymore after a redundancy and considerable payscale drops due to the recession. I invested 10 years in what is now considered an unskilled profession as a printer assistant. We have considered marrying in Denmark this year and preparing to move to Ireland after I sell my house in the UK.

My question is will the durability of the relationship be an issue given we haven't lived together for 2 years. When I exercise my treaty rights will this be questioned or does being married bypass this issue. Anyone who really knows the answer I would greatly appreciate a response perhaps with reference to why this would not matter or some experience. My gf and I love each other very much. Her job is also on the shortage list for both the UK and Ireland. Problem in the UK is it doesn't meet the amount needed. In Ireland she would have to secure a job before traveling there. Any advice or ideas also would be golden. I have been worrying myself sleepless over this issues.

Thank you in advance

If you were to get married in Denmark she could move to Ireland with you as your spouse, she wouldn't need a job to go with you.
If you intended to move back to the UK together you would have to obtain employment or be self employed in Ireland.

You definitely have to find employment in Ireland (or self employed) because she would only be issued a visa for 3 months. You could claim self sufficiency, but that doesn't seem like it would work for you from what you wrote.
You wouldn't be able to apply for an EEA family permit within that first 3 months. What I mean to say is you could apply, nothing to stop you, but it wouldn't be approved.

To qualify for the EEA family permit you would have to convince the ECO that you have "transferred your life" to the member state for a qualifying period.
Unfortunately what constitutes this qualifying period is not outlined. The general consensus seems to be at least 6 months.
This comes under Regulation 9 ( family members of British citizens) This was amended as of 01/01/2014. Their aim was to make it tougher for Brits to use the Surrinder Singh route.

I'm not sure if you actually want to sell your house or you feel that you have to sell it because of your situation. Someone else on the forum might be able to advise you in a more accurate way regarding property back in the UK. I'm not sure myself if you maintain a property in the UK that will satisfy the "transference of life".

[Radconn]

I'm not sure if you are familiar with the Regulation 9 but here is the actual wording of the new version as of 01/01/2014

Regulation 9 (family members of British citizens)

5. For regulation 9, substitute—
“Family members of British citizens

9. (1) If the conditions in paragraph (2) are satisfied, these Regulations apply to a person who is the family member of a British citizen as if the British citizen (“P”) were an EEA national.

(2) The conditions are that—

(a)P is residing in an EEA State as a worker or self-employed person or was so residing before returning to the United Kingdom;

(b)if the family member of P is P’s spouse or civil partner, the parties are living together in the EEA State or had entered into the marriage or civil partnership and were living together in the EEA State before the British citizen returned to the United Kingdom; and

(c)the centre of P’s life has transferred to the EEA State where P resided as a worker or self-employed person.

(3) Factors relevant to whether the centre of P’s life has transferred to another EEA State include—

(a)the period of residence in the EEA State as a worker or self-employed person;

(b)the location of P’s principal residence;

(c)the degree of integration of P in the EEA State.

(4) Where these Regulations apply to the family member of P, P is to be treated as holding a valid passport issued by an EEA State for the purpose of the application of regulation 13 to that family member.”.

[Ukgentle]

Radconn thank you very much for taking the time to respond in such a detailed manner. I was aware that the UK have been trying to tighten up the laws reguarding this route. I didnt have the exact citation such as you have provided here so that in itself is very useful. I will be compiling this info and holding onto it for future reference. I actually might have a trick or two up my sleeve in terms of securing a job in Ireland but I will have to see how things pan out in that direction. Its actually my birthday tonight/today and that is about the best present I could hope for to be honest.

I could rent my house but might sell it anyway to fund my way through school also when in Ireland. Its only a house some people might balk at that statement but then I would ask how much they truly love their partner. I can replace my house I could never replace my gf and hopefully soon to be wife this year off the back of this information.

I don't agree with how the UK are currently directing this country and think they should take a strong hard look. Not only are people like myself finding themselves jobless due to bad decisions by managing directors in a number of industries; but also skilled labour is now leaving this country for greener pastures abroad. Not nearly enough is being invested into the country in areas that might help it roll into the future on more solid ground. I am disapointed as a UK national that I have to go this far just to be with someone I love.

I just hit a rough patch in life and as a single man with full bills and a house to pay its extremely hard to fund another education. I know who I want to spend my life with and its got nothing to do with manipulating the situation its just a last resort. I am not saying its impossible or complaining it absolutely cannot be done but I feel it should be easier for foreign nationals also to come here who have a skill level that would add to the country as a whole. Instead it feels a certain political agenda fuels a culture that invites low skilled labor here in order to possibly compete on an international level with the likes of China and India due to their low cost of manufacturing. Problem is in my eyes it is watering down the society as a whole and making a far wider gap between rich and poor.

I will have to see what happens and if I remain in Ireland I might not be so unhappy. The rates of unemployment are manipulated within the UK part time workers are deemed to be "employed" whereas in Ireland they are not. On that basis the Figures between Ireland and the UK for unemployment aren't that different. America is close in comparison also. Western society as a whole is facing huge problems because it has refused to invest back into the youth and fund certain education and programs that it once built itself upon. I can only hope that changes so that when I do hopefully have children they actually get something for their social tax contributions when they most need it

Apologies to anyone regarding this as a rant. I have spent months pouring over this information regarding the immigration situation and felt there was no hope with it. I sincerely hope I can go down this route or some other door opens for me in life. I would like to redirect my life and my partner would help in that and give so much back to the country in return. Maybe we get that chance in Ireland. I might just stay there permanently anyway after going back to school there.

[357mag]

How do you intend to get your girl into Denmark? And why not marry in her home country?

My girl is Filipino in UK and an overstayer because her application arrived a day late at UKBA. We are waiting for her divorce hopefully nisi granted soon but it looks like she would be arrested at the alter if we apply to get married here. Maybe Denmark would suit us, or we may try Ireland as durable relationship but not "lived together for more than 2 years" which seems to be creeping in to the requirement. We cant get married in Philippines because divorce is not recognised there.

I agree entirely with the sentiment of your post btw.