Non EU spouse of EU citizen - Query

[stmani]

Hi, I am living in ireland and just have received 6 months family permit for UK. We are planning to move to UK in a week or so. My query is, how can I extend my family permit after 6 months in UK and does my wife (EU national) have to be in employment to get 5 years stamp or only my employment in UK would be enough. Will I get 5 years stamp altogethor or they only issue one year stamp every year? what are other requirements???

Appreciate your help!!!

[yankeegirl]

After you are in the UK you then apply for residence card which is valid for 5 years, using form EEA2. What nationalitly is your wife? In general, she just needs to be exercising treaty rights here. This could be as a jobseeker, worker, self employed, student, etc.

[John]

how can I extend my family permit after 6 months in UK

First point ... not after six months .... you apply before the expiry of the 6-month EEA Family Permit.

Your wife, the EEA Citizen, needs to be exercising EU/EEA Treaty Rights in the UK. She could do that as an employed person, or indeed as a self-sufficient person ..... living from your employment income. In other words ... flexibility .... you can work and/or she can work.

Have either of you got jobs to go to?

Finally, which EEA Country is your wife from? One of the countries in the EEA prior to the expansion on 01.05.04? Or one of the countries that joined on 01.05.04 or on 01.01.07 .... if so, which one.

Length of validity when you get your Residence Card? 5 years ... not a series of 5 1-year cards.

Make a careful note of you when travel to the UK, especially if no stamps put into passports, and if that is the case, retain your travel tickets, if you have any. (You might not, you might be simply driving across the border into Northern Ireland.)

[stmani]

thanks a million for your help.......

my wife is from latvia and no, neither of us in employment yet. As soon as we get there i will try to find one for myself.

any suggestions on job hunting???? im an accountant with 4 yrs experience.

thanks a lot.

[John]

OK, as an A8 national your wife will need to register on the WRS ... the Worker Registration Scheme .... but subject to that is fully entitled to work in the UK.

You? You already have your 6-month EEA Family Permit and thus have confirmation of your ability to work in the UK. Wait until you get to the UK? As an Accountant I do not expect you to find any great problem finding work, but even before you arrive, why not look at a site such as www.reed.co.uk which specialises in Accountancy vacancies.

By the way, if your wife is employed, and thus registered on the WRS, when you need to apply for your Residence Card, you will not use the form EEA2, but instead will need to use form FMRS, given the special status given to WRS-registered A8 nationals.

[stmani]

thanks john, i really appreciate your help......you have made things fairly grand for us just before heading to a new country.

[Directive/2004/38/EC]

how can I extend my family permit after 6 months in UK

First point ... not after six months .... you apply before the expiry of the 6-month EEA Family Permit.

You are not required to apply for a Residence Card in the UK. You can, if you want, apply any time after you arrive in the UK.

That being said, it is worth applying for one as soon as possible.

[John]

You are not required to apply for a Residence Card in the UK.

Technically correct but in practice it would not be possible for him to remain in employment without such an application.

Apply anytime after arrival? As soon as it is clear that Treaty Rights are being exercised .... otherwise the conclusion might be they are just here as tourists ... not exercising Treaty Rights (except as tourists) ..... and thus he would not be eligible for a Residence Card.

[Magarhe]

how can I extend my family permit after 6 months in UK

First point ... not after six months .... you apply before the expiry of the 6-month EEA Family Permit.

You are not required to apply for a Residence Card in the UK. You can, if you want, apply any time after you arrive in the UK.

That being said, it is worth applying for one as soon as possible.

Does anyone know what happens if you apply for the Residence Stamp after the 6 month period has expired? (note: residence stamp for me because my partner is an A8 )

I can't find anything about when it HAS to be in by... all I have found is that is has to be after the WRS has gone through.

Are EEA family members without the residence stamp allowed to work? or only during the initial 6 month period? or during the application for the residence stamp?

How "optional" is the residence stamp? is it more of a shortcut to proving your rights say when entering the country?

And finally, why can't all this be spelled out on the official websites. It isn't that hard to put bullet points there instead of assuming everyone knows what to do when it isn't mentioned anywhere. (obviously I don't expect an answer to that one

Thanks in advance

[petkanov]

I am from BUlgaria, but came to the UK on EEA family permit with my wife who is Lithuanian 2 years ago when BG wasn't EU country. I got a job and we send the documents to the Home Office for EEA Residence Permit for my wife, and Residence Card as a family member of EU citizen for me. 8 weeks later she got a permit for 5 years, and I got my residence document stamped for 5 years. No WRS. My wife applied as a self sufficient person and we showed my payslips. So if you get a job, your eu spouce can apply as a self sufficient and you will get the 5 year residence card instead of the 1 year stamps for spouces of WRS registered people. I would recommend that route, as it is painless and totally legal. As a matter of law the UK doesn't require you to have valid EEA Family Permit, but if you travel abroad and your EEA family permit expired you need to get a new one. That's why it is advisable to get residence card to avoid inconvinient situations, but legally you are not required to have it.

[Directive/2004/38/EC]

Magarhe,

What is an "A8", that your partner is on?

The Residence Card is optional. You can apply for it any time after you arrive. 1 week to 10 years after you arrive. But...

The Residence Card is good for two things:
(1) entering the country hassle free
(2) proving to an employer that you are free to work legally

If an employer sees the Residence Card, she knows she can legally hire you. Otherwise you may have a hard time proving your right to work.

It is mentioned on the web site. It talks about how the Residence Card is optional. See "Guidance for EEA & Swiss nationals and their families (INF 18)" at http://eumovement.wordpress.com/info-united-kingdom/

[Magarhe]

Magarhe,

What is an "A8", that your partner is on?

The Residence Card is optional. You can apply for it any time after you arrive. 1 week to 10 years after you arrive. But...

The Residence Card is good for two things:
(1) entering the country hassle free
(2) proving to an employer that you are free to work legally

If an employer sees the Residence Card, she knows she can legally hire you. Otherwise you may have a hard time proving your right to work.

It is mentioned on the web site. It talks about how the Residence Card is optional. See "Guidance for EEA & Swiss nationals and their families (INF 18)" at http://eumovement.wordpress.com/info-united-kingdom/

My wife is A8 Hungarian, has got her WRS and been working for 4.5 months so far (so has not completed an entire 12 months yet, so not ready for residence card).

I am Australian, have my 6 months EEA Family Permit for entry, which I used to get here in the first place, and have been here for around 5 months.

I have been through those sites many times, they tell me everything I need to know about getting here, but not enough about what to do once I am here to extend my stay. Well, they do, if I go to the Border and Immigration Agency site and fill in and send an FMRS form.

But they don't say if I have to send that form to get my residence stamp in before my 6 months EEA Family Permit expires.

What happens if I don't send it in before the 6 months are up? My guess is that I can put that form in after it expires, because if I had to put it in before it expires, it would probably be mentioned 100 times on every site "fill in your form or be thrown out".

The main reason this is an issue is because to apply for the residence stamp, I need to submit my passport and my wifes passport, which they could hold for 2 months as they process the application - making it very difficult to travel on a holiday in the next month.

If my EEA Family Permit expires at the end of its 6 months, is that bad? What does it mean? Can I then still get a Residence Stamp? Does it mean I can't work or re-enter the country without applying for another one, or something?

Does anyone have experience getting a Residence Stamp - do they send the passports back quickly before the application is fully processed? (they did this with the WRS application). That would be ideal.

thanks

[Magarhe]

Magarhe,

What is an "A8", that your partner is on?

Sorry I just realised what you meant by that question.

My wife is an EU national, Hungarian, one of the Ascention 8 countries (Hungary) which means she needed to do the worker registration scheme ie register and work for a 12 month period before she can get a residence certificate.

I might give border control a call and post my results here.

[Magarhe]

I might give border control a call and post my results here.

Official response from calling:

- much better to apply before Family Permit expires, but not necessary.

- once you apply, you get a letter confirming you have applied, which can be used in meantime to help prove your status when looking for work etc..

- you can request your passport back and it will not hinder application. You can request this with a cover letter when you apply. Strangely the website gave me the opposite impression - that asking for your passport back early meant the application for residence stamp would be terminated.

fingers crossed

[Docterror]

I am from BUlgaria, but came to the UK on EEA family permit with my wife who is Lithuanian 2 years ago when BG wasn't EU country. I got a job and we send the documents to the Home Office for EEA Residence Permit for my wife, and Residence Card as a family member of EU citizen for me. 8 weeks later she got a permit for 5 years, and I got my residence document stamped for 5 years. No WRS. My wife applied as a self sufficient person and we showed my payslips. So if you get a job, your eu spouce can apply as a self sufficient and you will get the 5 year residence card instead of the 1 year stamps for spouces of WRS registered people. I would recommend that route, as it is painless and totally legal. As a matter of law the UK doesn't require you to have valid EEA Family Permit, but if you travel abroad and your EEA family permit expired you need to get a new one. That's why it is advisable to get residence card to avoid inconvinient situations, but legally you are not required to have it.

This was something that I have come across as well, albeit in a slightly different variation. After a 'yellow Registration Certificate ' was granted with an application for BR1, showing that the Romanian national was dependant on her WP based husband, we applied with the BR5 for him and was granted a 'Residence card of non-EEA family member of an EEA national'.

The irony of the situation is not only that, that effectively makes the husband the 'dependant of a dependant' but also that the European in this case cannot work at all, while her non-EEA husband has full EU rights! The question now facing us to go for a 'dependant of a dependant of a dependant' application and if so, which form to use!

[Magarhe]

Yes it is all quite strange, also a lot of work is created for everyone at every stage ... it appears Worker Registration and Border Control are not linked, you have to fill in everything from your WRS again in the application for the Residence Stamp.

Now, surely these things would be more secure if they were all linked through a single identity (your passport) so that when the WRS is attained, all other passports connected with that person are updated as well.

Anyway it is all good to know that these things are not essential, I won't be leaving the country until I get my letter confirming my application for residence stamp. As usual customer service was very friendly at border control (not being sarcastic) and very helpful.

[megmog]

Hi Stmani,

I just read Runie's post and now yours and it seems this is the way to go - the eea family permit - in order to get out of ireland.

Could you tell me... how long did it take to get the eea permit, and what did you submit as proof of legal residence in Ireland?

I have also asked Runie the same questions, We are in Ireland too, having the same problems as you did... would be grateful if you could share some more details of the process.

[limey]

Megmog: Read these links...

See here...
http://www.ukvisas.gov.uk/servlet/Front ... 8721068382

and here...
http://www.ind.homeoffice.gov.uk/applyi ... unationals

And here...
http://www.covlaw.org.uk/immigration/le ... let10.html

[megmog]

Thanks Limey.

I understand the basic process but I wanted to know from someone who is in the same situation as me what they submitted as evidence of their legal residence in Ireland if their EU1 was rejected by the DoJ in Ireland?

I asked the british embassy and they said we need to be resident here (Ireland) for 6 months (which we have been) but my husband (non-eu spouse) will have to show evidence of his legal residence.. which we dont have whilst our application is being processed, they leave you in a sort of limbo - without a visa or even a letter to show his status.

So what did you use as evidence of the non-eu spouse's legal residence?

[petereliot1]

me an my wife presently in ireland plan to move to uk, due to the eu1 crisis in ireland.
my wife is german and i am asian,
1- can and how long does it take to get a uk visitor visa for me?
2- can i work? i know she can work there once she is there but wht about me can i work too?

[Wanderer]

me an my wife presently in ireland plan to move to uk, due to the eu1 crisis in ireland.
my wife is german and i am asian,
1- can and how long does it take to get a uk visitor visa for me?
2- can i work? i know she can work there once she is there but wht about me can i work too?

Why didn't you mention the fact you are in Ireland on the other threads you started?

Read about the EEA Family permit.

[John]

What is your nationality?

You would not apply for a UK visitor visa. You would apply for an EEA Family Permit. And yes you can work, but need the EEA Family Permit to prove that you can work.

[Directive/2004/38/EC]

I asked the british embassy and they said we need to be resident here (Ireland) for 6 months (which we have been) but my husband (non-eu spouse) will have to show evidence of his legal residence.. which we dont have whilst our application is being processed, they leave you in a sort of limbo - without a visa or even a letter to show his status.

I am curious what you were asking the British embassy about that they said you had to have been resident for 6 months? For an EEA family permit?

[limey]

Megmog: You don't say what nationality you are, apart from that you are an EU citizen. That is important if you want a proper answer to your question.

[Magarhe]

Well, my EEA Family Permit expired and I still have not applied for my residence stamp because that would mean giving in my passport + wifes' passport and she needed it recently.

And, offerred a job, to start today - tadah! nobody knows what the law is on Family Permits and the agency refused to take me on because my Family Permit "expired" in July.

Me, my wife, my other agent independantly rang Border Control and were told that it is at the agencies' discretion whether to take me on.

My agency rang and apparently had a different story. But I have convinced them to ring again.

I cannot find the policy regarding this stated anywhere, the closest I have found is on the website

http://www.ind.homeoffice.gov.uk/lawand ... alworking/

Specifically in document “Changes to the law on preventing illegal working: short guidance for United Kingdom employersâ€