Help – I am a British national, how can I get elderly depend

[OyeLuckyOye]

Apologies, If I am at wrong section of this forum.

Can you please advise/help me to understand process as I want to bring my parents (mother & father) to the UK from India on dependent-visa (permanent). Please see below my family details:

Parents age: over 65 (Retired)
Country: India
Brother: Married and lives in India
Sister: Married and lives in India
Myself: Single

As my siblings are busy with their own family/kids in different cities in India therefore I'm planning to bring my parents in the UK on permanent (dependent) basis.

I have British Citizenship. Please can you guide me on the above, and also can you please advise on all the requirements/fees/documents related to this.

many thanks for any help.
Vikas

[CR001]

Virtually impossible to get these visas since the rules changed in July 2012 (we only know of 3-4 approvals since the changes). The UK does not permit chain migration and as your parents have family in their home country and care would be cheap, it will be even more difficult. It is a very expensive route, visa fees and NHS surcharge.

The main criteria they have to meet is listed below, the main ones highlighted in red :

https://www.gov.uk/join-family-in-uk/eligibility

Coming to be cared for - you’re an adult dependent relative

You must be dependent on a parent, grandchild, brother, sister, son or daughter of someone living permanently in the UK.

You must prove that:
you need long-term care to do everyday personal and household tasks
the care you need is not available or affordable in the country you live in
the person you’ll be joining in the UK will be able to support, accommodate and care for you without claiming public funds for at least 5 years
you’re 18 or over

If you choose to take the risk and apply and they are refused, it will effectively shut the door on any future visitor visas as their intention to settle in the UK will be known.

[Casa]

Even if they both needed daily care with washing, dressing etc, they have other children living in their home country. The Entry Clearance Office won't be interested in the fact that they're too busy with their own lives to help!

[Wanderer]

+2 - no chance with this one.

[OyeLuckyOye]

Thanks for your quick response and advice, so in this case what alternatives do I have to bring my parents on long term basis?
1. Is it possible to bring them to the UK on visitor visa but on long term basis i.e. they don’t have to travel to and fro on frequent basis
2. Do I need to apply for their visitor visa over here or it can only be done from India
3. What all documents will be needed.
Sorry for asking so many questions.. I have not much info., as I said, my intention to keep them with me as they are alone back home.
Please let me know, what is the best way I should think of.

Thanks,
Vikas

[CR001]

1. They can apply for a visit visa if they meet the requirements and can prove strong ties their home country. What they cannot do, even with a long term visa, is use it to 'live' in the UK, i.e. spend more time here than in India. As visitors, they cannot use the NHS and would need very decent travel insurance. Generally, they cannot spend more than 6 months out of 12 in the UK as visitors. If they arrive and the IO feels they are in fact 'living' here rather than 'visiting' they can still be refused entry and put on a plane back. Have they ever visited the UK before?

2. They have to apply from India for a visitor visa. You can do the application online, but they will have to print, sign and submit with all the supporting documents.

3. https://www.gov.uk/standard-visitor-vis ... st-provide and https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... -documents

as I said, my intention to keep them with me as they are alone back home.

Well they aren't really are they? They have other children and grandchildren in India.

Please let me know, what is the best way I should think of.

There is no easy way or a way to try and circumvent the rules, which are only becoming harder. There have been a number of visit visa refusals for parents recently.

[Wanderer]

Thanks for your quick response and advice, so in this case what alternatives do I have to bring my parents on long term basis?
1. Is it possible to bring them to the UK on visitor visa but on long term basis i.e. they don’t have to travel to and fro on frequent basis
2. Do I need to apply for their visitor visa over here or it can only be done from India
3. What all documents will be needed.
Sorry for asking so many questions.. I have not much info., as I said, my intention to keep them with me as they are alone back home.
Please let me know, what is the best way I should think of.

Thanks,
Vikas

None really, try Surinder Singh route (google before asking), move a country thats supports chain migration like USA, or move back home to be with your parents.

[secret.simon]

And if you are thinking of Surinder Singh, better do it quickly. The EU Referendum is only two years away and may even be earlier (due to elections in Germany and France in 2017)

[pranjam]

I had a question on this topic as well so thought I would post it here. What happens if somebody does try to get the dependent parents visa which is refused and consequently the visit visa route is also closed, can they still use the surinder singh route to enter the UK?

Also after the new ruling giving people with EU Family Residence Permit the ability to enter the UK and subsequently apply for an EEA Family permit does it not mean that there are now in fact two ways to have your parents enter the country via the EU. Obviously the EU family residence permit will take longer but it is more straightforward as far as I know.

Also on the SSR - to get your parents in to the UK is it important that your spouse lives with you in the european country as well because you can base your "centre of life" in the european country while your spouse visits you on weekends. Is this advisable/feasible?

Can someone please clarify this.

[secret.simon]

I had a question on this topic as well so thought I would post it here. What happens if somebody does try to get the dependent parents visa which is refused and consequently the visit visa route is also closed, can they still use the surinder singh route to enter the UK?

Yes, they can. The Surinder Singh route operates under EEA Regulations and is not impacted by decisions taken under UK Immigration Rules.

I'm a bit lost about your subsequent questions, so forgive me for my questions, which may not sound too bright.

Also after the new ruling...

Which ruling are you referencing here? If it is by a European court, remember that it takes time for judgements to be integrated into the EEA Regulations, which is what the UK rules on EEA citizens and their family members are. The Immigration Officer will go by the EEA Regulations, not the court judgement.

...giving people with EU Family Residence Permit the ability to enter the UK and subsequently apply for an EEA Family permit does it not mean that there are now in fact two ways to have your parents enter the country via the EU. Obviously the EU family residence permit will take longer but it is more straightforward as far as I know.

I'm not very conversant with procedures under the EEA Regulations, but the EEA is the EU along with Norway and Iceland. From the UK's immigration viewpoint, they are the same. So, I'm confused about the EU Family residence permit vs the EEA family permit mentioned above. They are likely the same.

What would happen under Surinder Singh is that you would move the "center of your life" to another EEA country. Your parents can stay there with you to "strengthen family life" and they would be issued with the "Family Member of an EU/EEA citizen" by the other EEA country. When you then return to the UK, you will be treated as an EU/EEA citizen and your parents will be issued with an EEA family permit, just as they would have got in the other EU/EEA country.

Also on the SSR - to get your parents in to the UK is it important that your spouse lives with you in the european country as well because you can base your "centre of life" in the european country while your spouse visits you on weekends. Is this advisable/feasible?

I could be completely wrong about this as there is no clear definition of "centre of life", but if I were an immigration officer, I would be very suspicious if your wife did not accompany you (unless of course, the intention is to show that you have split). "Center of life" logically does not mean just staying in another EEA country, but where your job, your bank accounts, personal estate is, not where a six month vacation is spent.

To the mods: Given the direction this thread is taking, is it worth moving it to the EEA-route applications forums?

EDIT: I think I now know which judgement @pranjam is talking about. Is it the McCarthy case in the CJEU? All that means is that if the family members of an EEA citizen have got a residence card from one EEA Country, the UK can not force them to apply for and get its own EEA family permit. The UK must honour the family residence permits of all other EEA countries. Not sure how that gives another route to get your parents here.

[pranjam]

I meant another route in the sense that if the parents do get the EU Family permit the "Centre of Life" rules are no longer valid. So you can live and work in the EU during the week and come back to live in UK on weekends as long as you are still eligible to get the EU Family of an EEA citizen permit for your parents.

Through the SSR we have to follow the "Center of Life" rules which is more strict however maybe faster as you can in theory enter the UK after 3 months with your parents with the evidence that your "Center of Life" has moved to the EU. In this scenario you don't have to apply for an EU family permit for your parents as they could have stayed with you in the EU on a visit visa of sorts.

At least this is how I understand it although please feel free to correct me.

[secret.simon]

I see your logic. I would love to hear opinions from others (especially vinny and Obie) whether this option is viable. Can this thread be moved to the EEA Applications forum, where more people could comment on it.

[pranjam]

I have created a new post here http://www.immigrationboards.com/eea-ro ... 87072.html
Also posted the links to the relevant sections from the gov.uk website which state the rules around this, it seems way more straightforward than SSR and Centre of Life