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Child Citizenship Application - REFUSED

A section for posts relating to applications for Naturalisation or Registration as a British Citizen. Naturalisation

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ToonBarmy
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Child Citizenship Application - REFUSED

Post by ToonBarmy » Sun Apr 10, 2016 4:53 pm

Hi All
I am a newbie on here and would just like to start by thanking anyone who reads and / or replies to my post. Last week we got the bad news that my Stepdaughters British Citizenship application has been refused. She is a 7 year old child, has duel Swiss / Thai nationality, she acquired her Swiss passport via her Swiss biological father with whom she has no contact, her Thai mum (my wife) has gone through the Settlement Visa, ILR and British Citizenship steps already and thus is now British.

We applied under section 3(1) at the Home Secretary's discretion but this was refused as they do not classify her as being "settled" here under the immigration laws. They (HO) state that as the minor of an EEA national she cannot be settled here until either she has ILR or has acquired Permanent Residence under European law. She has been living here very happily and attending school for the past 2+ years now and is very much "British" with a stronger local accent even than myself.

We brought her here to the U.K on Dec 29th 2013 and she entered the U.K on her Swiss passport gained as stated via her biological Fathers Country of origin, this passport was applied for and granted via the Swiss Embassy, Bangkok, Thailand.

This was just prior to my wife applying for and being successful in acquiring ILR which in turn became Citizenship last October 2015 (so Mum is now a British Citizen and Passport holder). The whereabouts of "Dad" are unknown and he plays no part in his daughters life, this was explained within the application and this did not form any part of the refusal. As my stepdaughter traveled upon her Swiss passport and entered the U.K on this passport so no visa was applied for in Thailand, her stay here in the U.K is lawful and she does not require a visa to be here, I have checked with the HO and explained all the facts, I have been told she is here as an EEA / Swiss person, is counted as a "qualified person" and has the right of abode.

For her to apply for ILR now whilst this can only be applied for from within the U.K as I understand things because she does not have a visa so she cannot actually apply for ILR now ?, she I believe would need to either return to Thailand and start the whole visa process from there or apply for discretionary FLR from within the U.K, however this route as I understand it could only be taken on her Thai passport but not on her Swiss passport (which is how she entered the U.K). Her Thai passport will soon expire and she has no prospect of gaining a new one without either her biological fathers consent or my wife having sole custody, both of which points we are stuck on as detailed below, the Thai consulate have confirmed there is no exception or discretion with regards to this in terms of them issuing a new passport once the current one expires, no Thai passport = no FLR / ILR as I understand things.

And so for her to qualify under the EEA Permanent Residence requirements she needs to have been living here for 5 years, however her 5 years will not be complete until Dec 29th 2018 (5 years to the day she arrived), still relatively straightforward right ?, however this is complicated by the fact that her Swiss passport will expire on Dec 2nd 2018 - around 4 weeks short of her 5 years residency period and we basically have no chance to renew this or obtain a new Swiss passport as under Swiss law it can only be issued with either her biological fathers signature / permission, his whereabouts are unknown and he plays no part in his daughters life now and so obtaining his signature for a new Swiss passport is seemingly impossible (even if he could be traced it is very very unlikely he would consent to sign), the other way would be if my wife had sole custody, however her Swiss Court divorce decree gave no custody provisions as the divorce was applied for and undertaken by my wife but in her absence which apparently is very rare in Switzerland - her circumstances were quite unique. So whilst the Swiss were aware of the child they made no provision thus it is joint custody by default, the Thai Courts will not issue custody as it was not set aside within the original Swiss divorce decree and the Thai Court state the custody provisions must be made within this, also now that my stepdaughter lives here in the U.K so it now falls outside of there jurisdiction anyway as in Thai law she must be living within Thailand for them to even entertain such a case. I have then contacted a U.K lawyer and looked into obtaining a "Child Arrangement Order" via the U.K family Courts (U.K equivalent of custody) however the lawyer confirmed that as the position was there was no dispute that my stepdaughter lives with her mum, as the child's father was not on the scene and not contesting anything so they will not issue any Child Arrangement Order. So 3 Countries none of whom we can obtain custody from, no custody, no consent from my stepdaughters father = no new Swiss passport, again whilst the Swiss Embassy have been very sympathetic and helpful it has been made clear there is no discretion or loophole, no way around this.

So applying under the 5 years EEA residence rules seems impossible, as the HO letter states she would need to first acquire Permanent Residence under European law to later be able to gain British Citizenship we seem to be very stuck. As I understand things via a few phonecalls to the HO she would need / must have a valid European passport to acquire this and as outlined above her passport would just have expired and with no prospect of gaining a new one, we also looked into if she could apply in advance of the 5 years prior to the Swiss passport expiring but were told "no" that she must have completed 5 years residency here to gain PR.

What really frustrates me is I called any number of times the "0300" HO number prior to applying for my stepdaughters British Citizenship and checked we could apply even though my stepdaughter had only been in the U.K 2 years, and had entered on a Swiss passport, no visa ect ect, I went into every possible detail of her circumstances and situation but all I was ever told was "Yes" we could apply, there were no residency requirements as she was a 7 year old minor, as Mum already had her Citizenship we could apply - no ILR necessary as she had entered on Swiss passport ect, this we did then we fail due to her not being "settled" here, and to be settled her she must either have ILR or have lived here for 5 years to then gain PR, both of which I was repeatedly assured were not necessary prior to making the application, I checked and checked so many times!!!. :x

Should we appeal using form NR with a cover letter explaining our predicament or is this likely a waste of time and money ?, can anybody suggest a way forward as to me it seems whilst my stepdaughter can legally reside her now and is not breaking any immigration law being here, so there seems no realistic way forward for her to gain Citizenship alongside her Mum, she is in limbo and caught between a rock and a hard place, completely stuck.

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Re: Child Citizenship Application - REFUSED

Post by noajthan » Sun Apr 10, 2016 5:24 pm

Most unfortunate and challenging case.
I don't have a solution, merely some pointers and suggestions.

fyi - the HO helpline is notoriously unreliable (as you have discovered to your cost), and is not held accountable for its 'advice'.

The combination of mother under UK Immigration Regulations and daughter on EU route is the complication here.
With hindsight, daughter should have been brought into UK as mother's dependent; she would have eventually achieved ILR along with mom. (I faced a similarly challenging case for my own family yet managed to prevail in the end).

My understanding is, your step-daughter's position in UK is, as a bare minimum, assurred as she is (at the very least) an EEA/EU 'child in education';
that means she may reside and study in UK (at least) until the end of her primary and secondary education.
That gives you breathing space to dig into and solve the problem.

fyi - EEA/EU id cards are accepted as an alternative to passports for EEA/EU citizens on an EU migration route.

:idea: If renewing a passport is so problematic is there any way child can apply for a Swiss id card?

:idea: It is also worth digging into whether a current passport is actually required in order to apply for confirmation of PR.

fyi - the PR guidance states that if a passport is not available (ie to prove nationality and identity) then an explanation needs to be given
That may be a way ahead too.

:arrow: For EU route to succeed, you need to address the question of who is the sponsor.
The child is not going to be recognised as a qualified person exercising treaty rights unless she is deemed to be a self-sufficient person.
:!: To be a self-sufficient qualified person she will need to have CSI (heath insurance) in place.

We have seen a recent case reported in the forum where an EEA child was granted citizenship at discretion, ie under section 3(1), even though he had not acquired PR.

I will search out and post the link here for your reference.

In this case the father was also applying for citizenship; as I recall it, the child was granted registration on the basis of 'inheriting' the parent's PR status.
So that may not be a directly comparable case.

However it does confirm the registration at discretion guidance that says there may be exceptions to the general rule that in order to be registered a child needs to be free of all immigration time restrictions.
Discretion applied to the discretion, if you will.

Ref https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... structions
- for example see paragraphs 9.17.18 & also 9.17.24 - 9.17.27
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Re: Child Citizenship Application - REFUSED

Post by Casa » Sun Apr 10, 2016 5:33 pm

I'm afraid that I don't have any solution to the overall problem, but the Secretary of State was correct in refusing the application as indeed, PR (following 5 years of residence) is mandatory. In fact all applications for BC now require formal confirmation of PR before they will be considered. As you are already aware, neither does your step-daughter doesn't for ILR as she is here as an EEA national and again would need 5 years + 1 year under UK rules.
Regarding the flawed advice you were given over the telephone through the HO 'help line'. Regrettably, if you call 10 times, you will probably get 10 different answers. The advisors are notorious for giving incorrect information, even on the most simple of immigration issues. This article explains it well:
https://www.freemovement.org.uk/immigra ... pectation/

Edit: Pipped to the post by Noajthan :|
(Casa, not CR001)
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Re: Child Citizenship Application - REFUSED

Post by noajthan » Sun Apr 10, 2016 8:23 pm

Example of single case I'm aware of in which an EEA child was registered at discretion without having acquired PR:
http://www.immigrationboards.com/britis ... 1#p1327410

& http://www.immigrationboards.com/britis ... 1#p1328040

(Correction: it was evidently on basis of EEA mother's PR status not the father's as I had stated above)

Takeaway: It shows that, even if rarely, discretion can be applied to a discretionary Section 3(1) of BNA application.
All that is gold does not glitter; Not all those who wander are lost. E&OE.

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Re: Child Citizenship Application - REFUSED

Post by Richard W » Sun Apr 10, 2016 10:41 pm

The OP is the 'someone else' of the thread EEA Child of British Citizen. Unfortunately, there was no solution for the general problem.

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Re: Child Citizenship Application - REFUSED

Post by ohara » Mon Apr 11, 2016 7:22 am

Richard W wrote:The OP is the 'someone else' of the thread EEA Child of British Citizen. Unfortunately, there was no solution for the general problem.
I was in this situation (EEA child of a British by descent mother). However no attempt was ever made to register me. Aside from not being able to acquire PR as a dependent of my mother (as she had British as well as an EEA citizenship) and therefore having no way to exercise treaty rights, I believe I would have been eligible for registration under sections 3(2) and 3(5). Unfortunately, no attempt was ever made to register me.

I've never had any issues with my immigration status in the UK. I've also never had CSI.

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Re: Child Citizenship Application - REFUSED

Post by Richard W » Mon Apr 11, 2016 12:41 pm

ohara wrote:
Richard W wrote:I was in this situation (EEA child of a British by descent mother). However no attempt was ever made to register me. Aside from not being able to acquire PR as a dependent of my mother (as she had British as well as an EEA citizenship) and therefore having no way to exercise treaty rights, I believe I would have been eligible for registration under sections 3(2) and 3(5). Unfortunately, no attempt was ever made to register me.

I've never had any issues with my immigration status in the UK. I've also never had CSI.
Up until 16 July 2012, being British did not disqualify one from being an EEA national. As your signature says you acquired PR in June 2012, you were unlikely to have faced any problems.

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Re: Child Citizenship Application - REFUSED

Post by ohara » Mon Apr 11, 2016 12:50 pm

Richard W wrote:Up until 16 July 2012, being British did not disqualify one from being an EEA national. As your signature says you acquired PR in June 2012, you were unlikely to have faced any problems.
It's water under the bridge now anyway, as my mother died 3 years ago and I'm well over 18, but would I have been able to acquire PR through her being a worker? She was in employment continuously from at least 1997 until approximately 2008.

At the time I applied for my DCPR, I would have had pretty much zero evidence of her employment though.

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Re: Child Citizenship Application - REFUSED

Post by noajthan » Mon Apr 11, 2016 1:12 pm

Let's not stray from OP's topic.

ohara you have your own thread elsewhere detailing your migration journey.
Thanks for understanding.
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Re: Child Citizenship Application - REFUSED

Post by noajthan » Mon Apr 11, 2016 1:30 pm

@ToonBarmy, as ohara has mentioned it is possible for an EEA minor to live a stable life in UK untroubled by immigration matters even without acquiring PR. (My understanding is he eventually applied for his confirmation of PR as an adult in UK).

In your case you could explore various steps to generate a history and papertrail with the Swiss embassy who must have some sort of duty of care for their citizen.

This may help in the future if questions of identity arise when daughter's current Swiss passport expires - at least the embassy will be aware of their citizen.
You would have evidence of this and a papertrail to produce to interested parties (eg HO).

Suggest:

1) looking into registering daughter with embassy as a Swiss citizen living in UK.

https://www.eda.admin.ch/countries/unit ... dress.html

2) Make embassy aware daughter is under joint custody/responsibility of both parents and yet her Swiss father appears to have 'abandoned' her.

This will generate correspondence which can later explain why daughter cannot renew her passport (if she really cannot).
This will help when it comes to applying for confirmation of PR.

3) Look into applying for a Swiss id card; surely mother with joint custody can fulfill the position of responsible adult if one is required(?); (not sure).

This will provide an alternative proof of identity - useful for future confirmation PR application.

Any refusal (if due to lack of presence of Swiss father) will generate correspondence which can later explain why daughter cannot provide a valid identity document (if she really cannot).
Again, this will help when it comes to applying for confirmation of PR.

4) I am not completely sure how treaty rights works with EEA minors.
Daughter (if attending primary/secondary school) is certainly a 'minor in education' as mentioned before.

However, my understanding is, if you take out CSI (health insurance) and there is no reliance on state social assistance you should be able to demonstrate the child is exercising treaty rights as a self-sufficient person (just as an EEA adult can do).

This means her PR clock would be started and then her time spent residing in UK will count towards acquiring PR.

5) Having set this in place you could test the water by applying for an optional RC (residence certificate).

Success or failure with applying for the RC (before you wait 5 years and attempt to apply for confirmation of PR) would accomplish the following..

It would help indicate and confirm whether HO accept:
  • daughter's identity as an EEA/EU national;
    daughter's Swiss passport at least once (before it expires); thus harder for HO to question her identity at any later date;
    /confirm her residency in UK;
    /confirm her exercising of treaty rights;
Any issues would be flagged up early and give you a chance to address them before getting to the stage of applying for PR (or discovering a problem late in the day).

Possession of a RC is not necessary or mandatory in order to apply for confirmation of PR but it can only help bolster supporting documentation.


Hope it helps. Good luck.
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Re: Child Citizenship Application - REFUSED

Post by Richard W » Mon Apr 11, 2016 6:56 pm

noajthan wrote:@ToonBarmy, as ohara has mentioned it is possible for an EEA minor to live a stable life in UK untroubled by immigration matters even without without acquiring PR.
I trust you have examples besides Ohara, who achieved PR as a family member of his mother.

I'm wondering if removing the the Swiss girl would be a disproportionate interference with the right to a family life.

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Re: Child Citizenship Application - REFUSED

Post by Casa » Mon Apr 11, 2016 7:16 pm

Richard W wrote:
noajthan wrote:@ToonBarmy, as ohara has mentioned it is possible for an EEA minor to live a stable life in UK untroubled by immigration matters even without without acquiring PR.
I trust you have examples besides Ohara, who achieved PR as a family member of his mother.

I'm wondering if removing the the Swiss girl would be a disproportionate interference with the right to a family life.
Have I missed something? Did anyone mention the Swiss child being removed? :?
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Re: Child Citizenship Application - REFUSED

Post by noajthan » Mon Apr 11, 2016 7:43 pm

Richard W wrote:
noajthan wrote:@ToonBarmy, as ohara has mentioned it is possible for an EEA minor to live a stable life in UK untroubled by immigration matters even without acquiring PR.
I trust you have examples besides Ohara, who achieved PR as a family member of his mother.

I'm wondering if removing the the Swiss girl would be a disproportionate interference with the right to a family life.
Comments like that totally miss the point of above reassurances. And no need to scare your friend or acquaintance unnecessarily.

Friend ohara did not acquire PR as a minor (with a sponsor) at all.
It didn't impact him adversely. That's the point.

Obviously dozens, hundreds of EEA minors are sponsored by parents; that is the norm.
It is totally irrelevant here, as, unfortunately, there is no EEA sponsor in sight.

And no I don't maintain examples, the hive mind and databanks of the forum do that.

Removal is not on the table here. That is the value of being (at very least) a minor in education &/or self-sufficient.
And not least because there are strict guidelines and safeguards in the HO Admin Removal guide.
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Re: Child Citizenship Application - REFUSED

Post by Richard W » Mon Apr 11, 2016 8:27 pm

Casa wrote:Have I missed something? Did anyone mention the Swiss child being removed? :?
You've obviously have. The girl has no leave to remain, and apparently no basis of stay under the EEA Regulations. Unless there is some relevant EU regulation or treaty right we have not identified, she is an overstayer.

Now, there may well be an overlooked EU regulation. To keep the EEA immigration-related rules together, the EEA Regulations 2006 had to be amended to include the Baumbast/Ibrahim/Teixeira rights from Article 12 of Regulation No 1612/68 for children in education and, by extension, their carers.

There are a lot of EEA overstayers in the UK - one big group seems to be non-working wives of settled non-EEA husbands. The many failures to achieve PR that we see in the EEA Route forum correspond to another, similar group of one-time EEA overstayers.

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Re: Child Citizenship Application - REFUSED

Post by Casa » Mon Apr 11, 2016 8:55 pm

Your friend or acquaintance in their opening post wrote " They (HO) state that as the minor of an EEA national" I assumed this thread was about refusal of the BC application, not the risk of removal. I would be concerned that the direction you're taking this will cause unnecessary worry for the OP and family. I assume that are you are privy to more information than we have in this thread (or the one you opened requesting help with this) you can confirm that this case does not involve someone from a group of EEA overstayers. :?:
I stand with Noajthan's view
"My understanding is, your step-daughter's position in UK is, as a bare minimum, assurred as she is (at the very least) an EEA/EU 'child in education';
that means she may reside and study in UK (at least) until the end of her primary and secondary education.
That gives you breathing space to dig into and solve the problem."
(Casa, not CR001)
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Re: Child Citizenship Application - REFUSED

Post by Richard W » Mon Apr 11, 2016 10:18 pm

Casa wrote:Your friend or acquaintance in their opening post wrote " They (HO) state that as the minor of an EEA national" I assumed this thread was about refusal of the BC application, not the risk of removal.
Yes the OP wants advice on how to prevent the the citizenship application failing. I have no positive advice to give on this, and the positive example Noajthan gave is quite different once one considers the differences in the acquisition of ILR and PR. At least in family cases, parent and child usually get ILR together, even if the parent immigrates before the child. With PR, a child will not catch up with a parent, but what is significant is that their clocks are locked to one another. In the OP's family, there is no such synchronisation. The daughter has, so far as I am aware, never had a settlement-related UK visa. She entered the UK using the EEA-like privilege of the Swiss. The mother has never been an 'EEA national', and has never, so far as I am aware, entered the UK in the capacity of a family member of an EEA national. It's an unusual situation.

The OP is only an internet acquaintance whom I tried to help because I was alarmed by his situation. At the time I was trying to help an old friend with the maiden/married name problem his wife hit when renewing her British passport.

Recapping:
ToonBarmy wrote:As my stepdaughter traveled upon her Swiss passport and entered the U.K on this passport so no visa was applied for in Thailand, her stay here in the U.K is lawful and she does not require a visa to be here, I have checked with the HO and explained all the facts, I have been told she is here as an EEA / Swiss person, is counted as a "qualified person" and has the right of abode.
The OP has clearly been misinformed - quite possibly by the HO helpline. The daughter clearly doesn't have the right of abode - she isn't a Commonwealth citizen! I have no reason to believe she is a "qualified person", though it's just conceivable CSI is now in place. Unless she has recently been transformed into a 'self-sufficient' person,
Casa wrote:you can confirm that this case does not involve someone from a group of EEA overstayers. :?:
Just the daughter. The OP and his wife are British, and the OP has not mentioned any other children. So far as I can tell, ignorance of the law has lead to the daughter becoming an overstayer.
Casa wrote:I stand with Noajthan's view
"My understanding is, your step-daughter's position in UK is, as a bare minimum, assurred as she is (at the very least) an EEA/EU 'child in education';
that means she may reside and study in UK (at least) until the end of her primary and secondary education.
That gives you breathing space to dig into and solve the problem."
That sounds like' a reliance on the Teixeira ruling. However, if you reread the OP's post, there's no mention of the daughter's biological father ever having been in the UK, and the Teixeira ruling (and its transposition into the EEA Regulations, as part of Regulation 15A) relates only to the children of an 'EEA national' worker. The mother is a Thai/British dual national - there is no hint of her being Swiss. (If she were, it would vastly simplify matters.)

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Re: Child Citizenship Application - REFUSED

Post by Richard W » Mon Apr 11, 2016 10:28 pm

Casa wrote:you can confirm that this case does not involve someone from a group of EEA overstayers. :?:
I may have misunderstood your question. I mentioned two groups of overstayers because one doesn't hear of action being taken against them. But in a sense, the daughter does match the description. Many people just assume that EU nationals can freely move to other EU countries, and don't realise that they need to exercise treaty rights. In this case, the assumption was the OP's. So perhaps the answer should be, "No, I can't, because it does."

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Re: Child Citizenship Application - REFUSED

Post by noajthan » Tue Apr 12, 2016 12:41 am

Richard W wrote:
Casa wrote:Have I missed something? Did anyone mention the Swiss child being removed? :?
You've obviously have. The girl has no leave to remain, and apparently no basis of stay under the EEA Regulations. Unless there is some relevant EU regulation or treaty right we have not identified, she is an overstayer.
Mention of overstay and leave to remain are wholly inappropriate as OP's daughter is not following a UK immigration trajectory.

If, whether through ignorance or oversight, daughter is not exercising treaty rights that is readily addressed (as OP has been advised already).

Some fundamentals (that do not rely on secret or lost EEA regulations):
a) There is no age limit or restriction on EEA/EU nationals enjoying free movement;

b) There is no age limit or restriction on EEA/EU nationals exercising treaty rights in other member states (than 'home' state);

c) There is no age limit or restriction on EEA/EU nationals residing in other member states (than 'home' state);

d) If a self-sufficient EEA/EU national (qualified person) has access to all necessary resources there is no requirement or stipulation whatsoever as to their origin;

e) Apart from not being a burden on the state's social assistance system, a key requirement is that the citizen has sickness/health insurance.

@ToonBarmy, as advised in my bunch of suggestions and action plan (posted previously), does daughter have CSI (yet):?:

:arrow: If so, your daughter's PR clock will be ticking nicely. If not, suggest actioning at least that item asap.
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Re: Child Citizenship Application - REFUSED

Post by Richard W » Tue Apr 12, 2016 1:06 am

noajthan wrote:If a self-sufficient EEA/EU national (qualified person) has access to all necessary resources there is no requirement or stipulation whatsoever as to their origin;
What if the family is in receipt of child benefit and working tax credit? They have been; it is conceivable that their situation has improved recently).

Would CSI be needed just for the daughter?

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Re: Child Citizenship Application - REFUSED

Post by noajthan » Tue Apr 12, 2016 9:00 am

Richard W wrote:
noajthan wrote:If a self-sufficient EEA/EU national (qualified person) has access to all necessary resources there is no requirement or stipulation whatsoever as to their origin;
What if the family is in receipt of child benefit and working tax credit? They have been; it is conceivable that their situation has improved recently).

Would CSI be needed just for the daughter?
It all seems rather speculative if OP is unable to present facts of his case.
Plenty of open questions for OP and no intimation of progress/queries.

The BCs don't need CSI, they are out of scope; they are not (and cannot be) dependents of a minor in an EU migration context.
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Re: Child Citizenship Application - REFUSED

Post by Casa » Tue Apr 12, 2016 12:42 pm

Richard W wrote:
noajthan wrote:If a self-sufficient EEA/EU national (qualified person) has access to all necessary resources there is no requirement or stipulation whatsoever as to their origin;
What if the family is in receipt of child benefit and working tax credit? They have been; it is conceivable that their situation has improved recently.
Would CSI be needed just for the daughter?
Moderator edit: Please do not posts links to other immigration forums, now removed
(Casa, not CR001)
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Re: Child Citizenship Application - REFUSED

Post by Richard W » Tue Apr 12, 2016 8:03 pm

noajthan wrote:The BCs don't need CSI, they are out of scope; they are not (and cannot be) dependents of a minor in an EU migration context.
The principles for calculating self-sufficiency for members of a mixed family seem to be complex or awaiting case law. Is a 7-year old child living on its own entitled to social assistance? Can the parents make all their resources available to the child, or are they supposed to feed, clothe and shelter themselves?

ToonBarmy
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Re: Child Citizenship Application - REFUSED

Post by ToonBarmy » Sun Jul 31, 2016 5:34 pm

Hi

Many thanks for all previous replies, it has been a number of Months since original posting, we have since appealed on form NR though this is very likely a waste of time, i probably have a greater chance of hitting the EuroMillions jackpot than the reconsideration has of being successful, but with the support of our local MP we have tried, we should find out by December assuming the reconsideration takes the full 6 months.

Regarding some of the points raised previously, well we do have a high probability of being able to obtain my stepdaughter a Swiss identity card in the coming month so this would negate the issue of not having a valid Swiss passport at the time of applying for PR, however this of course is now complicated by Brexit and any such implications - the timing of when we officially apply to leave and when we do leave are likely going to be very relevant, IF my stepdaughter does qualify for PR then the 5 years residency would not be complete until 28th Dec 2018.

Regarding the issues raised of CSI, having spoken to an registered OISC adviser and having made six separate calls to HO (i know, i know their information is not very reliable as highlighted in previous posts) i have been given the same information consistently by both the OISC adviser and HO,
: My daughter is here lawfully, as an EEA national, whilst she is here due to her Swiss nationality, she is NOT classified as being a qualified person in education whom would thus need to be "self sufficient" and needing to have CSI, as a minor there is i am told a lot of discretion, i have been told she does not need to have CSI, this would only apply to a student in education aged 16+.

Regarding myself and my wife claiming Child tax credit / Child benefit for my stepdaughter, again i am told this is not an issue, if we were EEA nationals making such a claim this would then be relevant to my daughter, as Brits we have been told it will not effect her application.

We still not have found a way to obtain new Swiss passport, though by hopefully acquiring a Swiss identity card this may become irrelevant, again following Brexit this route to PR - BC may as such become irrelevant anyway ?.

As i say i have been reassured there is no threat of removal, my stepdaughter is not classified as an over stayer and is here lawfully, she does not need CSI...now all / some of this may well be wrong /, but this is what i have been told every time by not only HO but also by an OISC adviser, i don't know whom else i can / should check with ? Citizens advice ?.

noajthan
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Re: Child Citizenship Application - REFUSED

Post by noajthan » Sun Jul 31, 2016 5:53 pm

Glad to hear all that wild talk of overstay has been put to bed.

No idea how much CSI would cost for a child but getting some in place would surely make daughter's position as a qualified person unassailable.
Once she has her id she could then shoot for RC.

Your analysis appears correct, she may not now have time to acquire PR before UK cuts itself adrift.

So possession of some EU documentation may prove its worth if any transitional arrangements are going to be put in place.
All that is gold does not glitter; Not all those who wander are lost. E&OE.

Richard W
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Re: Child Citizenship Application - REFUSED

Post by Richard W » Mon Aug 01, 2016 7:33 am

ToonBarmy wrote:Regarding the issues raised of CSI, having spoken to an registered OISC adviser and having made six separate calls to HO (i know, i know their information is not very reliable as highlighted in previous posts) i have been given the same information consistently by both the OISC adviser and HO,
: My daughter is here lawfully, as an EEA national, whilst she is here due to her Swiss nationality, she is NOT classified as being a qualified person in education whom would thus need to be "self sufficient" and needing to have CSI, as a minor there is i am told a lot of discretion, i have been told she does not need to have CSI, this would only apply to a student in education aged 16+.
Did they explain by what (British) EEA Regulation, (EU) directive and article, court judgement or concession she was lawfully present? Have they (or you) confused being present lawfully with merely not going to be removed? Discretion would be highly relevant to the latter decision.
ToonBarmy wrote:Regarding myself and my wife claiming Child tax credit / Child benefit for my stepdaughter, again i am told this is not an issue, if we were EEA nationals making such a claim this would then be relevant to my daughter, as Brits we have been told it will not effect her application.
What application are you talking about? Registration at discretion? Registration as a qualified person?

Brexit isn't the only issue. Swexit is also looking likely, as the Swiss people have formally rejected free movement.

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