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Have a work permit--do I have stay at my job forever?

Forum to discuss all things Blarney | Ireland immigration

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giblet
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Have a work permit--do I have stay at my job forever?

Post by giblet » Wed Jan 30, 2008 3:58 pm

I'm a US citizen living in Ireland. I have a work permit for the specific company I work at. I will be getting it renewed this month for another 3 years. However, this means that I have to work here if I want to stay in Ireland, right?

Once I get the new work permit, I assume I will get my passport stamped again to allow me to stay in the country until it expires. So does this mean I can stay here but not work? What if I did freelance work for companies in the States? Am I basically a slave now?

seabhcan
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Re: Have a work permit--do I have stay at my job forever?

Post by seabhcan » Wed Jan 30, 2008 4:12 pm

giblet wrote:I'm a US citizen living in Ireland. I have a work permit for the specific company I work at. I will be getting it renewed this month for another 3 years. However, this means that I have to work here if I want to stay in Ireland, right?

Once I get the new work permit, I assume I will get my passport stamped again to allow me to stay in the country until it expires. So does this mean I can stay here but not work? What if I did freelance work for companies in the States? Am I basically a slave now?
Yip, you have to work for that company if you want your permit to be valid. After a few years you can apply for a green card which will allow you to change jobs.

If you do work for a US company here, you're in a legal gray zone. If they pay you into your US account, you probably have to pay US tax, and then you wouldn't be technically working here (?).

But if you gave up your work permit, you could only stay in Ireland for up to 90 days as a tourist.

giblet
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Post by giblet » Wed Jan 30, 2008 4:15 pm

No, I work for a company here and get paid in Euro into my Ireland account.

The thing is, my stamp that's currently in my passport says I can be in the country for a year, I just can't work unless I have a valid work permit. So doesn't that mean if I quit I could stay here until that date if I wasn't working?

And how long for a green card?

What about doing freelance/contractor work for the States from within Ireland?

Marielmcp
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Post by Marielmcp » Wed Jan 30, 2008 5:22 pm

Technically if you quit you would either have to find a new job asap and then get a new work permit or leave the country.

The green card is only for specific industries and even that requires that you have a job and a work permit of sorts - it's just slightly different. They make it sound like it's better than a normal permit, but really it isn't.

If you were doing freelance work for US companies you would have to show that you have enough money to support yourself and would get a totally different kind of visa.

Welcome to the club...I'm also a US citizen and have been stuck in the same job for the last 6 years, have applied for residency and that's taking forever to get through...Good luck!

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Post by Administrator » Wed Jan 30, 2008 5:23 pm

.
giblet wrote:The thing is, my stamp that's currently in my passport says I can be in the country for a year, I just can't work unless I have a valid work permit. So doesn't that mean if I quit I could stay here until that date if I wasn't working?
Be VERY careful about that. I have a four-year visa in my passport (Latvia). However, the terms of that visa are:

- I have an employment contract with a company (my own, in fact, but any will do)

- that contract is the basis for the government to issue me a work permit

- and both of those requirements then provide the basis for a residence permit, which allows me to stay in the country

HOWEVER. If anything about the work contract changes, I must report the exact changes to the government within 10 days (NOT 10 working days!). If the contract no longer meets the legal requirements for a foreigner (me, non-EU, U.S. citizen) ... then the work permit and the residence permits both become automatically void & I have to begin again.

So, if my work changes, I cannot just stay in the country for the duration of the visa. The law requires me to report the change and to get the visa annulled, and to leave the country or change my status immediately. I'm an overstayer after ten days and subject to criminal charges should I fail to do so.


Even if I change work contracts, my work permit & residency permit are interrupted and I have to get new ones, which means I begin my clock all over again. This last bit is quite unusual .. but that's the law of the country I'm in.

giblet wrote:What about doing freelance/contractor work for the States from within Ireland?
You need a separate permit to do that.

Consider setting up your own company. Ireland is one of the more favorable countries in the EU to do that. As the owner & shareholder & director of the company, you have the basis to issue yourself a work contract and thus be self-employed.

Again, be careful. In some cases (mine, for example), my work permit is based upon a full-time job. I can't get three work permits for part-time to add up to one full-time. I need a permit for every job I do (for anything I do that generates income), but one of those work contracts must be for a single employer for a 40 hour a week full-time position to be the basis for a work permit & thus residency.

I can't give you the details how to do this in Ireland .. but this is the general overview of what is possible. And, as an employee of that EU company, you can perform most business activities that you wish just about anywhere, any time throughout the EU. Just have to get the paperwork right.


The even bigger picture is that you do not want to interrupt your permits if you are going for permanent residency or naturalization. So, keep working for your current company, get your own set up & established on the side, then have your personal company sponsor switching your permits from your current employer to preserve continuity.

Then you would effectively be 'free lance' throughout the EU. Just get your articles of incorporation set up properly to cover all activities that would be necessary to keep the business running.

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ferrellk
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Post by ferrellk » Wed Jan 30, 2008 9:24 pm

I may be showing my ignorance...but why can't you look for new work while working for your current employer?

seabhcan
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Post by seabhcan » Wed Jan 30, 2008 9:37 pm

ferrellk wrote:I may be showing my ignorance...but why can't you look for new work while working for your current employer?
You can look, but if you find a job you have to being the whole process of getting a work permit from the beginning.

giblet
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Post by giblet » Wed Jan 30, 2008 9:58 pm

Administrator wrote:So, if my work changes, I cannot just stay in the country for the duration of the visa. The law requires me to report the change and to get the visa annulled, and to leave the country or change my status immediately. I'm an overstayer after ten days and subject to criminal charges should I fail to do so.
The stamp in my passport says:
"Permitted to remain in Ireland on conditions that the holder does not enter employment unless the employer has obtained a permit, does not engage in any business or profession without the Minister of Justice and does not remain later than DATE.

To my reading, there's no provision about whether or not I quit my job. Is there something else I should be looking at? I'm not suggesting I break the law by any means, I just am not sure I understand the law!

Administrator wrote:Consider setting up your own company. Ireland is one of the more favorable countries in the EU to do that. As the owner & shareholder & director of the company, you have the basis to issue yourself a work contract and thus be self-employed.
This is a great idea, and one I will look into. I looked at similar programs in Germany, I think, but they required bringing in 1mm Euro to start the business. Don't see that happening!

I also have a HSMP for the UK, so I guess I could just move there if need be.

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Post by Dawie » Thu Jan 31, 2008 4:52 pm

In the UK, and I'm pretty sure it would apply in Ireland too, you cannot just start your own business and then sponsor your own work permit! That would be a ridiculous loophole in immigration law, and if that were the case, everybody would just come over here, register a company, and then sponsor themselves.
In a few years time we'll look back on immigration control like we look back on American prohibition in the thirties - futile and counter-productive.

giblet
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Is self-employment possible?

Post by giblet » Thu Apr 24, 2008 5:44 am

Is there a legal way for a non-EU citizen to live in Ireland and be self-employed or start their own business? I know there are schemes for this sort of thing in other countries, but not sure about Ireland.

ferrellk
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Post by ferrellk » Thu Apr 24, 2008 1:14 pm

So, if you are already in Ireland on one work permit, and you decide at some point you want to change jobs - can you look for work legally while on a permit? If you find another employer willing to sponsor you, do you then have to leave country again while they apply for a permit? Does the new permit count towards the 5 years for LTR?

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Post by victor8600 » Fri Apr 25, 2008 2:28 pm

ferrellk wrote:So, if you are already in Ireland on one work permit, and you decide at some point you want to change jobs - can you look for work legally while on a permit? If you find another employer willing to sponsor you, do you then have to leave country again while they apply for a permit? Does the new permit count towards the 5 years for LTR?
Yes, No, Yes.

1. You should always look for a better job ;), and the law does not stop you.
2. You do need need to leave the country. You only need to leave Ireland if you were on visit/study visa and wish to work.
3. Yes, all time you were registered in GNIB as being legally in the state, counts towards the 5 years for LTR.
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