Tier1:English Lang Reqs for hsmp approval prior December,06

[farazfastian]

Hi Guys,

I was reading the English Language Requirement:Degree Taught in English section which requires following:

The qualification must:
• be recognised by UK NARIC as equivalent to at least a UK
Bachelor’s degree;
• have been taught in English to a standard comparable
to that of level C1 on the Council of Europe’s Common
European Framework of Reference for Languages: Learning,
Teaching, Assessment (CEFR).

In order to prove above either your qualification should be available in Self Assessment Tool or you should have a letter from Naric saying specifically that your degree meets above mentioned criteria (ref 184, 185)

The letter i received from NARIC back in 2006 doesn't says anything about medium of instruction, I just want to know whats the current detail Naric mentions in the comparability letter? and if they don't mention medium of instruction then do we have to get a new letter from Naric, does anybody know about it?

Regards
Faraz

[UKbound]

Hi Faraz:

It's 2 parts really. You'd have to have a letter from NARIC saying that the degree is equivalent. Second part is that you'd have to get a letter from the university saying that it was taught in English.

Hope that helps.

[farazfastian]

Yes i understand this and i do have the letter from my university but did you read following from guidance notes?

161. Applicants meet the English language requirement if:
• they were last granted leave under a Tier 1 category
(other than Investors, where there is no English language
requirements) and are applying for an extension; or,
• they were last granted leave as a Highly Skilled Migrant
which was granted under the Immigration Rules which
came into force on 5 December 2006 and are applying for
an extension under a Tier 1 category.

162. As these applicants will have already provided evidence of
their English Language ability in a previous application they
are not required to provide further evidence.


163. Please note that applicants who are applying for Leave
to Remain under Tier 1 (General) and who have received
a previous grant of leave under an immigration category
that did not require a particular standard of English will be required to satisfy this requirement.

185. Where the applicant is unable to find details of their
qualification on the Self Assessment Tool, they may still
wish to claim points for the qualification in question. In
these circumstances applicants should contact UK NARIC
directly for an assessment of their qualification and, where
their qualification is found to meet the above requirements,
obtain a letter or confirmation certificate from UK NARIC.
Contact details for UK NARIC can be found on the following
website at www.naric.org.uk. Please note that there may
be a charge for this service.

As you can see they've not mentioned anything like letter from university what they want comparability letter from NARIC even for medium of instruction of your degree. I'm worried!

[UKbound]

Interesting guidance notes...

Degree taught in English
179. Applicants may provide evidence that they hold a degree
which is equivalent to UK Bachelor’s level or higher and which
was taught or researched in English to a particular level as
evidence of their English language ability.
180. The qualification must:
• be recognised by UK NARIC as equivalent to at least a UK
Bachelor’s degree;
• have been taught in English to a standard comparable
to that of level C1 on the Council of Europe’s Common
European Framework of Reference for Languages: Learning,
Teaching, Assessment (CEFR).
181. Where the degree was taken in a majority English speaking
country, listed below, the Agency will assume it to have been
taught in English:

and then - 182. Where the degree was taken in another country it will, in
all cases, be assessed by referring to the Self Assessment
Tool which is available on the Agency website. This tool
contains information on the equivalency of overseas
qualifications provided by UK NARIC.
183. Points can be claimed where the Self Assessment Tool
confirms that:
• The degree meets or exceeds the equivalent UK level
academic qualification; and
• the degree was taught to a competent standard
of English equivalent to level C1 on the Council of
Europe’s Common European Framework of Reference for
Languages: Learning, Teaching, Assessment (CEFR).

So it seems as though you need to confirm that it meets NARIC standards on the new self assessment tool online. Alternatively, it does seem like NARIC will have to issue something to say it was taught in equivalent English, which is interesting since I didn't think they did that.

Is your university on the website tool?.. If so, then you're fine. If not, then it seems like there's more work to do.

[farazfastian]

No it is not that's why it looks like extension wont be easy. I'm from Pakistan and strangely all the top universities are not there in the assessment tool, the only few unis you'll find are the one affiliated from UK.
This is unacceptable, i don't know what they are up to now.

[farazfastian]

Hi guys,

Just investigated the matter with NARIC and looks like they cannot help in this scenario, here's the reply from them

Dear Faraz,


Thank you for your e-mail.

The role of UK NARIC is to assess and compare national levels of overseas qualifications in order to determine their standing in the British education system. It is not part of our evaluation service to comment on the medium of instruction of a qualification.

UK NARIC is currently helping the Border and Immigration Authority (BIA) with qualification equivalency and English language proficiency for the new Points Based System. We are able to help individuals who contact us directly with understanding the level of their qualification when compared to the UK qualification frameworks (through a Letter of Comparability), but we are not able to help individuals who contact us directly with English language proficiency.



The BIA system uses data that has been compiled by UK NARIC to determine whether a migrant's qualification demonstrates that they have the English language proficiency levels as determined by BIA. This data has been developed solely for the use by BIA. The information on the database identifies the institutions that have met the criteria specified by BIA.



The level of English language proficiency has been determined by whether English was the medium of instruction for the migrant's studies. For more information about the English Language Requirement then please see the BIA's Tier 1 (General) Policy Guidance available on the website at www.bia.homeoffice.gov.uk. UK NARIC is unable to enter into any communication about English language proficiency with any individual migrant, their employers or their representatives.



I hope this is of assistance and clarifies the situation.



Anna


Anna Cronshaw

Core Services Group Manager
UK NARIC

I'm waiting for the reply from BIA, if they dont accept the letter from university too then the only option will be left is IELTS, waste of time and money

Cheers!
Faraz

[nini]

Faraz:

I face the same problem like you!

I have got MBA from Germany which taught in English, Naric has assessed that it is equivalent to UK Master degree in 2005. I asked Naric by phone twice and what they responded me is that they can't further assess the English level in C 1 or not .
Then I have asked the home office , I got two different response from HO , one said you need a letter from university to approve that it was taught in English. another one (just yesterday I phoned them again) they responsed that in this case I must take the IELTS to reach 6.5 . Then I said I have took IELTS in FEB and reached level 6 only which was acceptable in Feb , but why you keep changing your policy which isn't fair for the applicants who just in different period to extention their visa.

I'm HSMP visa holder which is nearly 4 years in UK, recently JR has won the case, Home office is unlawful to put the retrospective policy to the people who already in UK, but at the moment, the HO still need time to implement, Faraz: I don't know when is your visa expiry date?
I used to let one agency to assess whether I fit for the Tier 1, the agency .
said if I can show HO my MBA certificate written in English and my transcripts are all written in English ,it should be OK already ,by the way I already assessed by NARIC the degree level is equal to UK degree level. That's it. I have the 75 points already ,just one double point is the English level . same like you . Please let me know your update news .

Hopefully you can pass the Tier1 .
My visa will expiry on 15th of July which is only 2 and half months now. I'm still waiting ....

[nini]

Do you give E-mail to BIA?

If you only phone them, different people will give you different answer, they are mass as well!!
I don't know if it is better if they give you written response.

But I once e-mail to HO, they didn't response my mail and just let me phone them.

What a mess of the current HO policy!

[farazfastian]

I can understand your frustration, I have been to this pain and that's why I decided to go for ielts to end this forever. believe me ielts is nothng I didn't prepare for it and I'm sure u can easily get 6.5

I was confused again coz of JR decision to wait for new system or go for tier-1 but again I've decided to go for tier-1 extension.

good luck in ur extension!

[nini]

hi Faraz:
Thanks for your quickly responded my message.
I really only got IELTS 6 band. maybe the IELTS also isn't so fair to everybody , At the very beginning, they only gave me 5.5 band, I feel so much surprised for this result ! I can't believe my English level is so lower ,otherwise I can't finish my master degree . Then I appeal for re-assess my IELTS , then they increase to 6.0 .Maybe I really can re-take IELTS and lucky enough to get 6.5. But just feel too tired to deal with this IELTS.

At the moment,JR has win, so even they still think I can't meet Tier1 , they can't refuse my visa , maybe pending till the new implement policy come out. if you are fully confidence for your Tier 1 , you just apply for it.

When is your visa expiry date? how many years do you already in Uk?

[nini]

The home office require NARIC to assess not only degree level but also English level , but why Naric said they can't do this job for us . If they can't do ,why Home office let them make this assessment ? It seems a contradiction policy.

In home office website, they also written that home office will approve it .
It is the most confused point here from the people who degree taught in English but must use Naric .

[ashishashah]

Hi All,
There is a tool on BIA website (cannot recollect exact webaddress)..But if u enter yiur Degree Details on it, it will say that you get Eng. Language point or not...TAke a print out and attach with your Appn..SIMPLE!!!

Also in the form ,you need to give your degree details, so in case case worker needs to cross check on the website..I feel that this is really good, no need to run after your college/University to get letter etc..

Hope now the confusion is cleared

[farazfastian]

If you confused on English requirement in Tier-1, i would recommend you to apply under JR decision in that case they can't reject your extension.

Regards

[nedian21]

No it is not that's why it looks like extension wont be easy. I'm from Pakistan and strangely all the top universities are not there in the assessment tool, the only few unis you'll find are the one affiliated from UK.
This is unacceptable, i don't know what they are up to now.

Faraz I am in the same boat. My HSMP was approved on old rules but I got the approval letter in Dec 2006. My visa expires in Dec 2008 and I am not sure whether the English letter from my Bachelor University will be sufficient. The problem is that my Bachelor Uni (NED in Karachi) is there on the Self Assessment tool degree section but not on the English proficiency section. Same hold for my Masters uni in Germany. Since I have time I am waiting till JR is properly implemented on the BIA website.

[asifraza]

Hi guys,

I'm on 1+3 and mine is expiring on 15th July 2008. I'm in the same boat like others ... not sure what HO really wants with regards to the english language!

I found my degree on the self assessment tool but it wasn't under english language tick boxes so I'm not sure what to do apart from contacting NARIC for comparability.

My degree was taught in English ... do I still need to go for IELTS or else? I literally don't have time for this IELTS excercise.

[farazfastian]

Guys, here's the simple rule

If you are applying under tier-1 and your degree doesn't appear under Degree Taught in English then you need to show ielts or equivalent qualification

OR

You can apply under JR decision and there's no need to show any evidence at all apart from earnings provided your approval was prior Nov,06 and you wait for the JR implementation by HO

just my 2 cents... but i think it's crystal clear ini?

[push]

Hi,

Where can I find the assessment tool? Is it on the NARIC website?

thanks,


push_hsmp

[asifraza]

Guys, here's the simple rule

If you are applying under tier-1 and your degree doesn't appear under Degree Taught in English then you need to show ielts or equivalent qualification

OR

You can apply under JR decision and there's no need to show any evidence at all apart from earnings provided your approval was prior Nov,06 and you wait for the JR implementation by HO

just my 2 cents... but i think it's crystal clear ini?

Thanks for the info Faraz. Do you know anyone or is there any one on this forum who applied for extension under JR decision without actually showing anything for english? and got approval or else?

Also, if I'm going to apply under JR decision then what do I need to do apart from filling the Tier 1 form.

[farazfastian]

Dude no info on JR yet, the decision came hardly 10-15 days ago and there's no system in place as HO is still working on that.
HO has advised If your visa is expiring in few days then send your passport refering JR but you won't get your passport till new system in place but once again it's not clear what to send and which form to fill for applying under JR.

hope this helps...

[nedian21]

Guys, here's the simple rule

If you are applying under tier-1 and your degree doesn't appear under Degree Taught in English then you need to show ielts or equivalent qualification

OR

You can apply under JR decision and there's no need to show any evidence at all apart from earnings provided your approval was prior Nov,06 and you wait for the JR implementation by HO

just my 2 cents... but i think it's crystal clear ini?

Faraz bhai it isnt that simple . In my case I applied for HSMP on old rules in June 2006 and it was rejected. I appealed and I got an approval in Dec 2006. So although my HSMP was approved after Nov 2006 but in reality I was awarded HSMP based on old rules criteria and thus fall in JR category.

But as I said earlier wait n see (obviously for those who can and have time on their current visa)

[ashish2410]

Hi,

For HSMP English qualification, Do we require certificate from university which state that we completed our bachelor education in English or its sufficient to submit degree certificate incase the university is listed in self assessment pointcalculator.

Kindly help

[asifraza]

Hi,

For HSMP English qualification, Do we require certificate from university which state that we completed our bachelor education in English or its sufficient to submit degree certificate incase the university is listed in self assessment pointcalculator.

Kindly help

Thank you for your email,

A letter of confirmation from a university is not listed in the guidance notes as an acceptable form of evidence.
Regards,
Ross Hutchinson
Customer Service Advisor
Work Permits Customer Contact Centre
UK Border Agency
Home Office
PO Box 3468
Sheffield
S3 8WA

[nini]

quote;
If you are applying under tier-1 and your degree doesn't appear under Degree Taught in English then you need to show ielts or equivalent qualification



Where is the database that you can found whether your degree taught in English fit for what they called European C 1 level? in which link of their BIA website? who can point for me?thanks!

I'm always wonder why this policy become so complex. I have phoned the HO., two people gave me two different response, one said I need a letter from the university another one said I need to take IELTS to reach 6.5.
I knew I still have time to wait JR , but just wish to be clear.

So far all the people apply based on JR are still pending , The HO said it will be quickly but still don't know the exact time line yet.
thank you for potential help![/quote][/u]

[nini]

[quote]but we are not able to help individuals who contact us directly with English language proficiency.

The BIA system uses data that has been compiled by UK NARIC to determine whether a migrant's qualification demonstrates that they have the English language proficiency levels as determined by BIA. This data has been developed solely for the use by BIA. The information on the database identifies the institutions that have met the criteria specified by BIA.





If the data is sole for BIA , then how we can know whether our degree taught in English fit for the level that BIA required ,then how we can nake self assessment?

That is really ridiculous!

[hsmpinuk70]

Use the self-assessment tool http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/pointscalculator .

regards