ILR application > circumstance change > advice needed

[chickpea]

Hello,
I can't believe I'm posting this when I should be posting in the ILR application timeline. I have been in the UK as a spouse for 5 years as of two weeks ago. We've been collecting documents for the ILR application. I signed up for LITUK test, etc. A few nights before my test my husband said he had decided he no longer wanted to be married. What led to this is irrelevant, I think, but the finality was a surprise to me. So here are my facts/questions:

1. My current visa expires 11 May. I have a part-time academic job that I should probably be able to complete by that date, however...
2. I would guess that I have to leave the country by 11 May to not overstay my visa. Obviously I can't now apply for ILR. If I leave without having completed packing to move (no idea where I will go or how I will pay for it), will I be allowed back in to complete the move? I would imagine they might say I am a risk to remain illegally, having not applied for ILR?
3. If I overstay in order to say my goodbyes, figure out where to go, pack etc, I presume I run the risk of being barred from re-entering the UK? And certainly from being able to get any kind of future visa?
4. As mentioned I'm an academic (in a bad job market, impacted by Brexit) and have been applying - but only locally - for 3 years without success. *If I got a job at £30k or above* I could stay and transfer to Tier 2, am I right? I am still applying and almost all jobs are over that threshold.
5. FWIW I passed the LITUK test, because I'd paid I thought I should take it - now probably irrelevant?

While I'd like to consult an immigration lawyer I also find myself needing a divorce lawyer to see what rights I have and whether my spouse will have to pay for any moving etc. I really can't do both, either financially or time-wise.

Therefore, I am here to ask for advice or experiences of this sort of thing. Thanks in advance for any help or advice you can offer.

[chickpea]

Still curious, fairly urgently.

[chickpea]

I'd rather not have to keep bumping this up, but I'd certainly be surprised if there is no one on the forum with even the vaguest idea about my situation.

Advice welcome, experience of anything similar equally so!

[bruteforce]

any chance you could delay the separation proceedings for a bit longer so that you can apply? You will have to mutually agree this with your husband. I am not sure what law says about the timings of your marital affairs as you have already completed 5 years of residence as a spouse. I am sure someone on the forum will be able to advise you in this regard.

[chickpea]

Thanks for the reply - the immigration lawyer I asked (who came highly recommended) said that she would never advise perjuring oneself (ie he can't say he intends to live with me) and on top of that the high fee makes it even more unreasonable to do so.

I'm certainly open to suggestions though, I have collected all the documents for application by the end of March.

[wahi66]

Thanks for the reply - the immigration lawyer I asked (who came highly recommended) said that she would never advise perjuring oneself (ie he can't say he intends to live with me) and on top of that the high fee makes it even more unreasonable to do so.

I'm certainly open to suggestions though, I have collected all the documents for application by the end of March.

I would say ask your husband to get you through this after all its just the matter of couple of months. you guys dont have to be live together as you already got all the docs for application. you can move out temporary and called it a think about time just like in fight days etc.
in return you can offer him smooth and easy divorce and no fight on financial matters.
you/he can even start the divorce proceeding shortly after ILR application because it gonna take time for sure even if its a mutual consent divorce.

[chickpea]

I would say ask your husband to get you through this after all its just the matter of couple of months. you guys dont have to be live together as you already got all the docs for application. you can move out temporary and called it a think about time just like in fight days etc.
in return you can offer him smooth and easy divorce and no fight on financial matters.
you/he can even start the divorce proceeding shortly after ILR application because it gonna take time for sure even if its a mutual consent divorce.

So husband has now said he doesn't want to submit ILR for me and in any case the immigration lawyer I asked said bad idea/perjury. So I'm out of luck there (but saving £3k?!).

So back to original question:
ANY advice on my rights or what might happen if I do *OR* if I don't leave the UK by the expiration of my current LTR...?????

I am hopeful I might get a job making enough to switch to Tier 2, but my experience ever since the referendum makes me pessimistic re: my chances.

[CR001]

You must leave the UK by the date your visa expires. If you don't, you will be an overstayer and won't be allowed to work or use the NHS.

You cannot switch in country to tier 2 if you can get sponsorship. You have to apply from your home country.

[chickpea]

Thanks CR001.

My husband has apparently really screwed me over. Leave by expiry or basically forget coming back, really. I can't see how there is no penalty for people who do this, beyond a big divorce settlement I guess. A few weeks ago I thought it was just a bump in the road.

[wahi66]

I would say ask your husband to get you through this after all its just the matter of couple of months. you guys dont have to be live together as you already got all the docs for application. you can move out temporary and called it a think about time just like in fight days etc.
in return you can offer him smooth and easy divorce and no fight on financial matters.
you/he can even start the divorce proceeding shortly after ILR application because it gonna take time for sure even if its a mutual consent divorce.

So husband has now said he doesn't want to submit ILR for me and in any case the immigration lawyer I asked said bad idea/perjury. So I'm out of luck there (but saving £3k?!).

So back to original question:
ANY advice on my rights or what might happen if I do *OR* if I don't leave the UK by the expiration of my current LTR...?????

I am hopeful I might get a job making enough to switch to Tier 2, but my experience ever since the referendum makes me pessimistic re: my chances.

well unfortunately, there is nothing much you can do and most likely you ll have to go back to your country and try find another way to come back. if you had a child then things would have been different. but you will get a chance to give him tough time during divorce proceedings.

the only way is your husband's help so keep ringing the bells and never give up until you are gone to your country. even few hours on last day can change the whole thing.

good luck

[chickpea]

Thanks wahi66.

I think some days I am still really in shock.

[chickpea]

You must leave the UK by the date your visa expires. If you don't, you will be an overstayer and won't be allowed to work or use the NHS.

Question: any experience of - or thoughts on - what happens if you do NOT overstay but then come back in to finish up moving & legal stuff? I'm not going to move ahead of the date as I am working until the day before my LTR expires. I plan to exit to the EU then come back and finish up moving. (This is in part because I am applying for jobs in England, Scotland, NL, etc and no idea where to ship stuff to yet in any case.)

I anticipate trouble re-entering. I'll be with my 78 year old mother as well. I thought perhaps a note on letterhead from my lawyer stating I am just in process of divorce etc. Any other thoughts welcome.

[JB007]

but you will get a chance to give him tough time during divorce proceedings.

I wouldn't bank on that. A short marriage will means he wont' be required to give her much and she only worked part time during the marriage.

[JB007]

I plan to exit to the EU then come back and finish up moving. (This is in part because I am applying for jobs in England, Scotland, NL, etc and no idea where to ship stuff to yet in any case.)

I anticipate trouble re-entering. I'll be with my 78 year old mother as well. I thought perhaps a note on letterhead from my lawyer stating I am just in process of divorce etc. Any other thoughts welcome.

What ties to the US will you have when you visit, to show you will leave again?

[wahi66]

but you will get a chance to give him tough time during divorce proceedings.

I wouldn't bank on that. A short marriage will means he wont' be required to give her much and she only worked part time during the marriage.

naah still either spouse can strecth the proceedings unreasonablely and specially financial matters can rolls you in even after 5years old marriages. she can also claim one off payment or maintances even because other spouse is full time worker and earning more then her.

[chickpea]

naah still either spouse can strecth the proceedings unreasonablely and specially financial matters can rolls you in even after 5years old marriages. she can also claim one off payment or maintances even because other spouse is full time worker and earning more then her.

wahi66 is correct... it is precisely because he has been supporting me that he'll have to continue to do so for whatever a reasonable length of time is determined to be. As I can prove I have been job hunting widely and continuously for 3 years, the court will not assume I can get work. (I've even been turned down for temp work, which is either age-ism or over-qualified...?!) I'll also be able to claim half of any assets acquired during the marriage - which is basically all of them. In any case, as angry as I am I don't have the intention to clean him out, I just need enough to get back on my own feet somewhere.

And to keep this thread [more] relevant to the forum: I have not yet asked but think legally it might be relevant - as an immigrant spouse, my sponsor had to prove he could support me, that I wouldn't need benefits (and can't get them anyway), plus we have never needed to prove whether or not I work at all. So basically the sponsoring spouse has taken financial responsibility for the immigrant spouse. No reason that should change immediately simply because I have to leave the country - or so I would guess.

[chickpea]

What ties to the US will you have when you visit, to show you will leave again?

Most likely a plane ticket! A mother by my side. And a lawyer's letter that I am pursuing divorce proceedings.

[wahi66]

What ties to the US will you have when you visit, to show you will leave again?

Most likely a plane ticket! A mother by my side. And a lawyer's letter that I am pursuing divorce proceedings.

looks like something better then nothing.

[JB007]

What ties to the US will you have when you visit, to show you will leave again?

Most likely a plane ticket! A mother by my side. And a lawyer's letter that I am pursuing divorce proceedings.

Divorce proceedings in the UK is not proof of ties to the US to show that you will leave the UK after your visit, neither is bringing your elderly mother with you.

Read the government guide for supporting documents
https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... -documents

[JB007]

naah still either spouse can strecth the proceedings unreasonablely and specially financial matters can rolls you in even after 5years old marriages. she can also claim one off payment or maintances even because other spouse is full time worker and earning more then her.

It doesn't matter how long they try to drag out the dirvorce, the marriage has failed in a short time and that is what any financial award wiil be judged on. The fact that one party worked full time and the other didn't, doesn't mean that the one that worked full time has to pay for their ex for years on end. If there were children involved and both parents decided that one parent should stay at home to raise their children, that is a different matter, but is not the case here.

[chickpea]

1. Visit visa not applicable, Americans do not need a visa or documentation. For the third time: a plane ticket will certainly suffice. I'll be sure to double check again with my immigration lawyer. I'll let you know if I get barred from entering!

2. Helpfully the kind and considerate (non-ambulance chasing) divorce lawyer I have seen has a completely different answer about funds & maintenance. So I'll go with trusting him, as he has about 30 years of legal experience. Thanks.

Having been dumped by a husband who was unwilling to work on the marriage, having given everything I had to make it work, having been unable to find full time work in any of my chosen areas for three years, and now being kicked out of the country in a few weeks - without money, earnings or a home - I would very much appreciate compassionate answers here. And particularly since there appears to be more morale and legal support for my position, I'll just say that I hope we are right. If we are wrong I will be sure to update here. In fact I will update regardless.

[CR001]

1. Visit visa not applicable, Americans do not need a visa or documentation. For the third time: a plane ticket will certainly suffice. I'll be sure to double check again with my immigration lawyer. I'll let you know if I get barred from entering!

You don't need a PRE APPROVED visit visa, however you get stamped in as a visitor on arrival and you are still required to satisfy the IO that you are a genuine visitor with strong ties to your home countyr, which in your case will be difficult if you have been living here for 5 years on a spouse visa which is recently expired AND you are still married to a settled/British spouse. Note that your mother would have to also satisfy the IO to be granted entry to the UK. You do risk being refused entry to the UK.

2. Helpfully the kind and considerate (non-ambulance chasing) divorce lawyer I have seen has a completely different answer about funds & maintenance. So I'll go with trusting him, as he has about 30 years of legal experience. Thanks.

Any aspect of your divorce and/or settlement etc is not relevant to immigration issues.

[JB007]

1. Visit visa not applicable, Americans do not need a visa or documentation.

There are lots of countires who the UK allow their citizens to be a non-visa national for a visit.

If you put in USA and tourism, it comes up with this on the government site-
https://www.gov.uk/check-uk-visa

"You won’t need a visa to come to the UK

You can stay in the UK for up to 6 months without a visa.

However, you should bring the same documents you’d need to apply for a visa, to show to officers at the UK border. "

Then it gives the link to what I just gave you.

EDIT: CR001 beat me to it

[wahi66]

naah still either spouse can strecth the proceedings unreasonablely and specially financial matters can rolls you in even after 5years old marriages. she can also claim one off payment or maintances even because other spouse is full time worker and earning more then her.

It doesn't matter how long they try to drag out the dirvorce, the marriage has failed in a short time and that is what any financial award wiil be judged on.

negative. whatever gain has been achieved during marriage time (one year or 50 years) would be consider mutual wealth weather one pound or one million regardless of who earn and who doesnt.

The fact that one party worked full time and the other didn't, doesn't mean that the one that worked full time has to pay for their ex for years on end.

agreed and so time can be argued based on multiple factors such as, age, income, medical conditions etc etc but even in worst case one partner will get somehow something financially

If there were children involved and both parents decided that one parent should stay at home to raise their children, that is a different matter, but is not the case here.

agreed.

[chickpea]

Apologies for the belated post. I meant to update this thread with my border experiences. As discussed above, I was a bit worried about coming back through the U.K. after my spouse visa had expired, though I was only staying three days and had a plane ticket in hand. Of course I was still a “risk to remain” I suppose, and responses above indicated that I might/should have trouble re-entering the country. Here’s what happened coming back from France via Eurostar.

Passport control Gare du Nord.
As I approached with my mother -
UKBA: “Are you family?”
Me: “Yes, this is my mother.” (hands over two passports)
UKBA: “How long will you be in the UK?”
Me: “Three days.”
UKBA: “Where are you going after?”
Me: “Home to California.”
UKBA: “Have a nice day.”

Passports handed back with no stamp, no conditions, etc. The agent flipped through my pages only [I didn't notice any scanning - & fwiw I wrote this summary verbatim immediately after it happened so I wouldn't forget, so I am sure it is correct and I asked my mother to confirm too]. I am sure that legally there were conditions, that likely if they HAD stamped it then it would be the old “leave to enter for six months employment prohibited” (at least that’s what it was back the last I entered as a tourist, which was about 2005 maybe?).

Interestingly when I then left the UK three days later, there was zero passport control on exit. Literally. I could have sworn the last time I flew (last summer) that I went through a departure entrance with a scanned boarding card then saw a border agent then went through the security scanners. But south terminal at Gatwick there was no one looking at my passport except the check in agent and the gate agent when I boarded. So I wasn’t actually scanned OUT. And when I reentered the US there was of course no stamp etc. since I’m a US citizen. I’m now curious what proof I’d have had that I had not overstayed, beyond a boarding pass, if I had left by air before my visa expired. As it happens I left by train and so France stamped my passport that I had entered. France also stamped when I left. Those are the only marks in my passport since May. I’m in Canada now and my passport wasn’t stamped. (Which could be problematic if some day I once again have to report when and where I’ve been, as most of my U.K. visas have asked. I have used my passport as my record.)

In case anyone reading in future is curious on the financial aspect, my soon-to-be-ex is now paying a higher amount than I expected I would be awarded (MPS) and it will continue indefinitely until he agrees a financial settlement with me and it is approved by the court, or we will ask the courts to decide.

Thanks for the helpful answers, good luck to all migrants/immigrants!