Marriage Certificate Authentication

[soul.biz]

My wife is Canadian and I am Spanish. We are in Spain, trying to apply for her EEA National Family Permit for the UK. Apparently, we need to authenticate/legalize our marriage certificate in order for it to be a valid document for the application. Her tourist visa expires in November and the Canadian Embassy in Spain has informed us that the only way to legalize a marriage certificate for Spain is to a. send it back to Ontario where they will take approx 25 days to legalize it, b. then send it to the Spanish consul and finally, c. have the consul's signature authenticated in Spain by the Spanish Ministry of External Affairs.

This entire procedure will take more than a month, which we don´t have since my wife´s visa for Spain expires Nov 10.

Regarding this issue, my questions are the following:

1. Is it possible to authenticate the marriage certificate without having to send it back to Canada, as it takes about 25 working days and my wife´s tourist visa for Spain will expire before receiving the document?

2. If YES, what is the process and where do I send the marriage certificate* to have it authenticated? Please provide contact details of the embassy to send the document to as well as a phone number.

3. What is the time period to have it authenticated, as my wife´s visa for Spain will expire by November 10 ?

*NOTE: The Canadian Consulate in Spain WILL NOT authenticate a Canadian Marriage Certificate, as they only service Spanish Immigration and my situation concerns UK Immigration, which they are not willing to support.

PLEASE HELP! If we don´t figure this out soon, my wife will have to go back to Canada and apply for the UK Family permit from there!

[John]

Apparently, we need to authenticate/legalize our marriage certificate in order for it to be a valid document for the application.

Who has told you that?

Is the certificate in English? If not, you will need to supply, as well as the original certificate, a certified translation into English.

[Casa]

Doesn't sound right to me either. As John has already asked...is the certificate in English? If so, you should be able to present it as it is.

[soul.biz]

The marriage certificate is Canadian...normal, english, legal Canadian document...that´s why we didn´t think that we needed it to be legalized.

When you apply for the EEA Family Permit via Worldbridge, it states that if the certificate is not British or Spanish, then you have to have it legalized.

We then emailed Worldbridge with the situation and they clearly told us that it is necessary to legalize it. So, here we are trying to find out how to do it as quick as possible, without my wife having to go back to Canada.

So what do we do? Please help!

[John]

soul.biz, what nonsense! I am staggered! Why on earth is the UK Government insisting on using Spanish procedures?

Your wife is Canadian, so is not a visa national. That is, she does not need a visa in her passport to fly to the UK. So why doesn't she do that, and after she is on the UK, she simply applies for a Residence Card using form EEA2.

Download this document from the UKBA website, and in particular read 5.5.

[republique]

soul.biz, what nonsense! I am staggered! Why on earth is the UK Government insisting on using Spanish procedures?

Your wife is Canadian, so is not a visa national. That is, she does not need a visa in her passport to fly to the UK. So why doesn't she do that, and after she is on the UK, she simply applies for a Residence Card using form EEA2.

Download this document from the UKBA website, and in particular read 5.5.

I do not think the UK is trying to implement Spanish procedures. The requirement of authentication is very normal in the EEC for any NON EEC document so it isn't about it being from Spain or the UK
I dont know what kind of visa your wife has but it sounds like a visitor visa so this visa is not very substantive. If your wife wants to go with you to the UK, I don't see why she can't and meanwhile send your document back to Canada to get it legalized. As for where it is done and how long it takes, I think if you use google, you can help yourself in that area.
Good luck

[John]

I do not think the UK is trying to implement Spanish procedures.

Are you sure? It sounds like it to me. What it says on the Worldbridge website is :-

If it is not British or Spanish, it must be legalised for use in Spain.

I do not understand why the UK should be concerned about whether Spain accepts the validity of a marriage certificate.

If your wife wants to go with you to the UK, I don't see why she can't and meanwhile send your document back to Canada to get it legalized.

I think you miss the point. In the UK the Canadian marriage certificate will just be accepted. There will be no question of having to get it legalised!

No doubt UKBA and UKVisas have procedures in place to authenticate certificates from around the world. After all they have branches all over the world.

[republique]

I do not think the UK is trying to implement Spanish procedures.

Are you sure? It sounds like it to me. What it says on the Worldbridge website is :-

If it is not British or Spanish, it must be legalised for use in Spain.

I do not understand why the UK should be concerned about whether Spain accepts the validity of a marriage certificate.

If your wife wants to go with you to the UK, I don't see why she can't and meanwhile send your document back to Canada to get it legalized.

I think you miss the point. In the UK the Canadian marriage certificate will just be accepted. There will be no question of having to get it legalised!

No doubt UKBA and UKVisas have procedures in place to authenticate certificates from around the world. After all they have branches all over the world.

Please provide the link. However I don't think I need it because in rethinking this I realize the following.
Yes I get that the UK would accept it but then he wouldn't get the benefit of being able to apply for the EEA National Family permit which he is trying to circumvent by going through Spain even though his wife only has a visitor visa. I don't think it will impress the UK of his marriage certificate if he doesn't going through Spain, otherwise he can't pretend they are continuing their treaty rights in the UK.

[John]

Please provide the link.

The link to what? Not sure exactly what you are querying.

What I will do is provide a link to the Metock judgement ..... click here ..... and invite you to read at least the very end of that :-

Article 3(1) of Directive 2004/38 must be interpreted as meaning that a national of a non-member country who is the spouse of a Union citizen residing in a Member State whose nationality he does not possess and who accompanies or joins that Union citizen benefits from the provisions of that directive, irrespective of when and where their marriage took place and of how the national of a non-member country entered the host Member State.

In other words, irrespective of how the Canadian citizen is in the UK, the UK cannot refuse to deal with an application for a Residence Card, made on form EEA2.

he wouldn't get the benefit of being able to apply for the EEA National Family permi

The benefit? What benefit? The fact is, as you will appreciate, any Residence Card is merely confirmatory of the rights given automatically under the EU regulations, and thus the Canadian citizen will have their EU Treaty Rights even though no EEA Family Permit is held.

[republique]

Please provide the link.

The link to what? Not sure exactly what you are querying.

What I will do is provide a link to the Metock judgement ..... click here ..... and invite you to read at least the very end of that :-

Article 3(1) of Directive 2004/38 must be interpreted as meaning that a national of a non-member country who is the spouse of a Union citizen residing in a Member State whose nationality he does not possess and who accompanies or joins that Union citizen benefits from the provisions of that directive, irrespective of when and where their marriage took place and of how the national of a non-member country entered the host Member State.

In other words, irrespective of how the Canadian citizen is in the UK, the UK cannot refuse to deal with an application for a Residence Card, made on form EEA2.

he wouldn't get the benefit of being able to apply for the EEA National Family permi

The benefit? What benefit? The fact is, as you will appreciate, any Residence Card is merely confirmatory of the rights given automatically under the EU regulations, and thus the Canadian citizen will have their EU Treaty Rights even though no EEA Family Permit is held.

The Worldbridge linke where it says what you say it says.

[John]

OK, on this Worldbridge webpage, under the heading "If you are applying for a Family Permit".

[soul.biz]

Hi guys,

Although I really appreciate the help, the British Consulate does require the document to be legalised.

Since we´re not applying from Canada, I have to prove that the document is real. Had we applied within Canada, they would have authenticated the document without even informing me, once we would have sent the document with the marriage certificate away to Ottawa.

And yes, it´s true that Worldbridge requires that any document that is not British or Spanish must be authenticated for use in the UK: they want a stamp to be put on the back of the certificate to certify that it is a real copy and not a fake...maybe they´ve previously had fake ones...I don´t know.

So, I emailed Worldbridge to confirm whether I could skip that procedure, since the document is in English and since it´s Canadian and we have good relations with the UK. Worldbridge clearly stated in their reply that the Marriage Certificate would not be valid if it is not authenticated.

Next, I went to the Department of Foreign Affairs Canada website, where it clearly states that a marriage certificate which requires authentication can be sent to their department in Ottawa, where they will legalize it and send it back within approx. 25 days...clearly too long due to my wife´s visa status in Spain (expires 11/10); she has a visitor´s visa for a 3 month period and cannot re-enter the country for another 3 months.

That´s when I proceeded to state our case on this immigration board to find an answer as to any other, more efficient way to authenticate the certificate.

Yesterday evening, I also emailed the Canadian High Commission in London to inquire...turns out they can authenticate it AND within only 2 days upon receiving the document! The only downfall is that they requested for me to contact Worldbridge to ensure that it was okay to legalize the document from the UK or if the only option I have is to send the certificate back to Ottawa...and in that case have no choice but to send my wife back to Canada, where she will have to apply for the permit from there.

So, I´ve now emailed Worldbridge to see if it is hopefully okay to authenticate via the UK.

My wife can´t go into the UK on a visitor´s status because when you apply for an EEA National Family Permit, the UK specifically requires you to be outside of the country. Basically, the application will be void if you do so.


Thanks again for your replies!

[republique]

OK, on this Worldbridge webpage, under the heading "If you are applying for a Family Permit".

Ok i have reviewed the VAF5 form which is the relevant form and on this form, it does state that is the marriage must be legally recognised and documented. While I concede that there is room for interpretation as to whether that means it must be authenticated, I know that there is a regulation that Non EU documents generally have to be authenticated where the document proves the basis of the visa, in this case their relationship.
When WorldBridge's website states that if it is not British or Spanish, they are actually reiterating the Family Permit Declaration words. Whether the Declaration has muddled the meaning on the VAF5 form, I do not know.
As far as I can see they are giving Spain the benefit of the doubt by not requiring its marriage document to be legalized not because of the any doubt of authetication but based on the general agreement in the EU that such documents should be in either in English or French for the application.
This would be my take on the situation and as such it still means he has to get the document legalized in Canada.
And before you debate me on the EEA2 Form, that form would be relevant if they are already residing in the UK, they are not as they are in Spain.

[John]

My wife can´t go into the UK on a visitor´s status because when you apply for an EEA National Family Permit, the UK specifically requires you to be outside of the country.

Sorry, you misunderstand. I am not saying she would go to the UK to apply for an EEA Family Permit. She would go to the UK and apply for a Residence Card, if she wanted to.

And before you debate me on the EEA2 Form, that form would be relevant if they are already residing in the UK, they are not as they are in Spain.

Sorry, you have clearly not fully understood the important implications of the Metock judgement. That is, she can fly to the UK and simply make a EEA2 application in the UK. It does not matter at all if she has only just arrived, or if she is in the UK with visitor status. She would of course have EU Treaty Rights as soon as she arrives. Any Residence Card that is issued is merely confirmatory of the rights already held.

Indeed she is not obliged to ever apply for a Residence Card. But as a non-EEA citizen, it would be handy to have confirmation of her EU Treaty Rights, if only to make it easy to show employers that she has the right to work.

[republique]

My wife can´t go into the UK on a visitor´s status because when you apply for an EEA National Family Permit, the UK specifically requires you to be outside of the country.

Sorry, you misunderstand. I am not saying she would go to the UK to apply for an EEA Family Permit. She would go to the UK and apply for a Residence Card, if she wanted to.

And before you debate me on the EEA2 Form, that form would be relevant if they are already residing in the UK, they are not as they are in Spain.

Sorry, you have clearly not fully understood the important implications of the Metock judgement. That is, she can fly to the UK and simply make a EEA2 application in the UK. It does not matter at all if she has only just arrived, or if she is in the UK with visitor status. She would of course have EU Treaty Rights as soon as she arrives. Any Residence Card that is issued is merely confirmatory of the rights already held.

Indeed she is not obliged to ever apply for a Residence Card. But as a non-EEA citizen, it would be handy to have confirmation of her EU Treaty Rights, if only to make it easy to show employers that she has the right to work.

Based on soulbiz comments, it pretty much confirms what I have said that the document has to be legalized
Whether she can actually fly into the uk is debatable but as soulbiz has just confirmed above she is not supposed to do that because in fact to avail yourself of EEA2, the EU national must be already exercising his right in the UK, he is not doing that. Yes I guess he can fly there and apply for his permit and afterwards get one for his wife. I feel the EEA2 is for people already established in the UK, not for those who are coming.

And don't worry I understood the Metock ruling and if they had started the process directly from canada instead of trying to be funny and do an end run around via spain, they probably could have made use of that ruling. I belive that that ruling is based in fact arising from Ireland who wanted to disregard Eu Nationals who had a relationship such as marriage but coming not directly from within the EU and tried to pretend you had to have been enjoying your marraige in the EU first before applying.

[soul.biz]

Thank you so much for all of your input!

John, may I please have the website where you are getting all of this useful information. If my wife can go to the UK and then apply for the EEA2, that would be much simpler than applying for the Family Permit (it is only valid for 6months and she will have to apply for her Residence as soon as she is in the UK anyways).

I wonder what the use is for the Family Permit in that case...isn´t it just beating around the bush?

Please forward the link, I would greatly appreciate it!

[John]

Whether she can actually fly into the uk is debatable but as soulbiz has just confirmed above she is not supposed to do that because in fact to avail yourself of EEA2, the EU national must be already exercising his right in the UK, he is not doing that.

Your understanding of this matter is not correct. As it says in reg. 11 of the UK's 2006 regulations :-

Right of admission to the United Kingdom
11.—(1) An EEA national must be admitted to the United Kingdom if he produces on arrival a valid national identity card or passport issued by an EEA State.
(2) A person who is not an EEA national must be admitted to the United Kingdom if he is a family member of an EEA national ......

So I certainly would not recommend the Canadian Citizen preceding the Spanish Citizen into the UK, but nothing to stop them arriving together, or her coming after her Spanish husband.

John, may I please have the website where you are getting all of this useful information.

There are two webpages I would point out to you :-

• Click here for details of the instructions that UKBA gives to its staff dealing with applications on the EEA series of forms. For example, in Annex A you will see a link to the 2006 regulations mentioned above.
• Click here for the relevant section of the instructions given to Border Force staff ..... the immigration officers you see at a UK Port of Entry.

Also, yesterday, I provided a link to the ECJ Metock judgement. That judgement is important clarification of the rights possessed by non-EEA family members.

[republique]

Whether she can actually fly into the uk is debatable but as soulbiz has just confirmed above she is not supposed to do that because in fact to avail yourself of EEA2, the EU national must be already exercising his right in the UK, he is not doing that.

Your understanding of this matter is not correct. As it says in reg. 11 of the UK's 2006 regulations :-

Right of admission to the United Kingdom
11.—(1) An EEA national must be admitted to the United Kingdom if he produces on arrival a valid national identity card or passport issued by an EEA State.
(2) A person who is not an EEA national must be admitted to the United Kingdom if he is a family member of an EEA national ......

So I certainly would not recommend the Canadian Citizen preceding the Spanish Citizen into the UK, but nothing to stop them arriving together, or her coming after her Spanish husband.

John, may I please have the website where you are getting all of this useful information.

There are two webpages I would point out to you :-

• Click here for details of the instructions that UKBA gives to its staff dealing with applications on the EEA series of forms. For example, in Annex A you will see a link to the 2006 regulations mentioned above.
• Click here for the relevant section of the instructions given to Border Force staff ..... the immigration officers you see at a UK Port of Entry.

Also, yesterday, I provided a link to the ECJ Metock judgement. That judgement is important clarification of the rights possessed by non-EEA family members.

Hi John,
If you say so, I am trying to make sense to the experience of the OP with Worldbridge. And to me it doesn't make sense that there are 2 different applications VAF5 and EEA2. If it is as easy as to just fly in together and apply, then by all means, do so. And perhaps this Metock ruling makes the 2 separate different absolete and as a result makes the course of action you suggest the correct one. And I am for whatever gets the OP his desired goal as quickly and painlessly as possible providing the restraints are expectations are managed
Further, my main point was the legalization/authentication of the marriage certificate which I said several times is very common requirement for Non EU documents and it certainly was not the UK trying to implement Spanish rules.

[Richard66]

What a tempest in the tea! Your wife is not a visa national. You can travel vto the UK for 3 months just like that, no need to exercise treaty rights. The treaty rights thing comes after the three months have expired and once you are there, apply for the residence card!

[soul.biz]

Yes, we´re aware that she can legally stay in the UK, but will she be able to work? I mean, she doesn´t want to just sit at home, and we really don´t want to take the risk and go to the UK to find that she can´t work for a certain length of time because she doesn´t have the paperwork proving that she´s legally entitled to work.

Basically, we want to be prepared for every and any situation that pops up when arriving there, and having the Family Permit makes us feel safe in the sense that we have proof that she can work there and live there like a regular citizen for a certain period of time, during which we can apply for a residence card.

[Richard66]

The EEA FP was designed as a substitute visa for family members who are visa nationals. It is meant to make it possible for such family members to reach the UK. Your wife's right to work is not derived from an EEA FP or indeed from a residence card, but from her relationship to you. The card merely confirms such a right exists. What you need to find out is how to get the Residence card for her once in the UK. It is here where your marriage certificate will become useful. Read here:

Issue of registration certificate
16. —(1) The Secretary of State must issue a registration certificate to a qualified person immediately on application and production of—

(a) a valid identity card or passport issued by an EEA State;

(b) proof that he is a qualified person.

(2) In the case of a worker, confirmation of the worker's engagement from his employer or a certificate of employment is sufficient proof for the purposes of paragraph (1)(b).

(3) The Secretary of State must issue a registration certificate to an EEA national who is the family member of a qualified person or of an EEA national with a permanent right of residence under regulation 15 immediately on application and production of—

(a) a valid identity card or passport issued by an EEA State; and

(b) proof that the applicant is such a family member.

Issue of residence card
17. —(1) The Secretary of State must issue a residence card to a person who is not an EEA national and is the family member of a qualified person or of an EEA national with a permanent right of residence under regulation 15 on application and production of—

(a) a valid passport; and

(b) proof that the applicant is such a family member.

Have you not applied for the Spanish residence card? Would this not solve her visa problem in Spain for the time being?

[soul.biz]

Thank you for your help.

We were told by the embassy that she will not legally be entitled to work in Spain for approx 8 months, which is the time it takes for the application to be processed. It´s too long a period for us to wait, and in that case we would have been better off staying in Canada where we would be making a much higher income and have lower living expenses.

[Richard66]

She does not need the permit to work. Possession or not of the card cannot affect her rights. It is written in the Directive an d very possibly not into Spanish law either.

But what I was thinking was something else: once she has applied for a residence card in Spain you need no longer worry that her 90 are up.

Also the maximum period allowed for in the Directive (and I believe: better check) for the issue of the card is 6 months.

[John]

Richard66, do appreciate that the EEA Citizen here is Spanish! It is therefore a question of whether the Surinder Singh principle applies, and if it does not, then it is Spanish immigration law that applies, not the EU directive.

[Richard66]

Yes, John, you are correct and I forgot to mention foreknowledge!

It says in the Spanish transposition of Directive 2004/38 (Real Decreto 240/2007, de 16 de febrero ) that

Igualmente, el derecho a la reagrupación familiar se determina como un derecho inherente al ciudadano de un Estado miembro, pero asociado necesariamente al ejercicio de su derecho de libre circulación y residencia en el territorio de los otros Estados miembros, todo ello de conformidad con la normativa comunitaria y con la Jurisprudencia del Tribunal de Justicia de las Comunidades Europeas. En este sentido, para regular la reagrupación familiar de ciudadanos españoles que no han ejercido el derecho de libre circulación, se introduce una Disposición final tercera que, a su vez, introduce dos nuevas Disposiciones adicionales, decimonovena y vigésima, en el Reglamento de la Ley Orgánica 4/2000, sobre derechos y libertades de los extranjeros en España y su integración social, aprobado por Real Decreto 2393/2004, de 30 de diciembre. Estas Disposiciones protegen especialmente al cónyuge o pareja de ciudadano español y a sus descendientes menores de veintiún años, mayores de dicha edad que vivan a su cargo, o incapaces.

This is the article mentioned:

Dos. Se introduce una disposición adicional vigésima:

«Disposición adicional vigésima. Normativa aplicable a miembros de la familia de ciudadano español que no tengan la nacionalidad de un Estado miembro de la Unión Europea o de un Estado parte en el Acuerdo sobre el Espacio Económico Europeo.

1. El Real Decreto 240/2007, de 16 de febrero, sobre entrada, libre circulación y residencia en España de ciudadanos de los Estados miembros de la Unión Europea y de otros Estados parte en el Acuerdo sobre el Espacio Económico Europeo, será de aplicación, cualquiera que sea su nacionalidad, y en los términos previstos por éste, a los familiares de ciudadano español, cuando le acompañen o se reúnan con él, y estén incluidos en una de las siguientes categorías:

a) A su cónyuge, siempre que no haya recaído el acuerdo o la declaración de nulidad del vínculo matrimonial, divorcio o separación legal.

It says in so many words that the incoporation is also applicable in the case of family members of Spanish citizens even if they have not exercised treaty rights. I think soul.biz will be able to unravel Spanish legalese.

Here is the link to the Decree:

http://www.mir.es/SGACAVT/derecho/rd/rd240_2007.html