Is paksitan unoffcially out of tier 1( highly skilled)?

adnantps · Post by **adnantps** » Fri Apr 17, 2009 1:06 am

None of pakistans university has got masters degrees equivalent to Uk masters. It means Pakistan is unofficially out of the tier-1 as many professionals here are not PHd; two of my friends have done masters frim FAST and NARIC gave equivalency of graduate to them. They qualified as per old rules and are here now. Surely; had they delayed their application by 1 mnth they would have been out of the scene.

blue.olive · Post by **blue.olive** » Fri Apr 17, 2009 3:15 am

if u got 3 to 4 year baclr degree along with master
get equalivlnt certificate from uk naric and u will be fine
when u send ur qualification to uk naric
write a covering letter and explain ur year in graudation
and master and then u will be eligble for educational points
good luck

adnantps · Post by **adnantps** » Fri Apr 17, 2009 11:15 am

thnx for the wish.. im already in UK:)

NARIC doesnt recognize any masters degree from paksitan...even if we explain to them as i stated about my friends who did masters from top university of paksitan(computer science) but managed to get bachelors(hons) only. Thtas why i said paksitan is 'unofficially' out if they dnrt change the equivalency criteria for masters

Immigrate2UK · Post by **Immigrate2UK** » Fri Apr 17, 2009 3:54 pm

Dears,
I am B.E(Bachelors in Engg) from NED Karachi and the course work was in English.
In the Points Calculator on UKBA my university is listed but I am unable to select and claim points on calculator. What to do?
What is the role of NARIC in Tier-1 program?
Do I need to get verification from NARIC even my degree is 4 years program taught in English?

yasa · Post by **yasa** » Fri Apr 17, 2009 3:55 pm

u r rite adnan.. virtually pakistan is outta list with none of the institute equivalent to their masters degree. very sad situation..

Spear · Post by **Spear** » Fri Apr 17, 2009 4:13 pm

I know this is a thread about Pakistan but I thought I will add the note that many taught (2 year) masters degrees from well know and recognised universities in the USA are no longer recognised by Naric as well. This includes University of California, University of Penn, Rutgers, NYU, Havard and Columbia.

maheshnair · Post by **maheshnair** » Fri Apr 17, 2009 4:27 pm

Spear wrote:I know this is a thread about Pakistan but I thought I will add the note that many taught (2 year) masters degrees from well know and recognised universities in the USA are no longer recognised by Naric as well. This includes University of California, University of Penn, Rutgers, NYU, Havard and Columbia.

Hi Guys ,

My collegeue @ work is from karachi and he also is afraid that when he tries on calculator his degree also dont qualify .

He called HO and they said , if it is not listed by naric then he is not eligible .

what i persoanlly feel is UK is trying to keep safe from potentially hazardous countries . Dont take it at heart guys , but looks like it is the truth .

I will give a small example , i just sent a 500 Â£ western union to my friend who is a muslim and a close freind of mine .

My westerb Union was locked and i was asked to come for a meeting with security of western union and they said his name is similar to a terrorist name ... Then it was unlocked after he scanned his passport .

Because of these terrorists , innocent guys are affected ..
But again we cant blame the HO ....

adnantps · Post by **adnantps** » Fri Apr 17, 2009 10:08 pm

Im not amused by this comment about hazardous countries;please refrain from making senseless comments when u havent visited the country's metro cities and professional hubs. It's the media that makes a country hazardous/safe....
and 'we cant blame the HO' thats really alarming argument...pakistan produces top IT professionals working in every sector; all of my batchmates are working abroad and in good companies like MICROSOFT , VISA, ACI , CISCO etc; please dont divert attention of this thread to a non issue.
Issue is; many universities in paksitan produce top IT professionals doctors and MBA's; so NARIC should rethink their equivalancy and give the righful university the status of UK equivalent masters. This applies to other countries also.

About the western union thing; try applying dubai VISA and if yr name matches any one in exit control list( be it of any religion or sect) u'll be denied unless u apply again.
If you transfer money to a person involved in fraud/money laundering or any other crime(totally unrelated to religion) western union's security will still call u. I consider your comment racially biased and strongly recommend you to think otherwise. The problem lies in media's projection.

kashifhbl · Post by **kashifhbl** » Sat Apr 18, 2009 11:26 am

YES DEAR PAKISTAN IS OUT, I got my VISA stamped but my friend who is more qualified , getting more salary than me is OUT now....

NO ONE FROM PAKISTAN WILL GET TIER-1 VISA under these RULE, Because there are tooo few PHDs in Pakistan.....

Muhammad Kashif

Post by **push** » Sat Apr 18, 2009 11:53 am

kashifhbl wrote:YES DEAR PAKISTAN IS OUT, I got my VISA stamped but my friend who is more qualified , getting more salary than me is OUT now....

NO ONE FROM PAKISTAN WILL GET TIER-1 VISA under these RULE, Because there are tooo few PHDs in Pakistan.....

Muhammad Kashif

This is something which needs be taken up at the Government to Government level. You guys should approach the Pakistan High Commission in UK and send petition to Govt. of Pakistan as well.

akafridi · Post by **akafridi** » Sat Apr 18, 2009 12:18 pm

hi adnantps
hopefully u will be fine. i have the same situation having MS(CS 2years) from FAST and BS(CS 4 years) from AIOU. I m Planning to send my Degrees to NARIC for Equ. Could you please give me the email or some other contact of ur friends who has send their degrees for Equ to NARIC, so i will have some better idea. I will be happy to hear u at my email at azamafridi@hotmail.com , I will be waiting ur responce. thank u. Infact HEC assure me that abt the Equ to master and ask me to contact us if some problem at NARIC. I even can forward their case to HEC if they are willing.
Thanks

jd · Post by jd » Sat Apr 18, 2009 5:29 pm

I agree with push_hsmp.

Does anyone know the process or if it is possible to raise this point at govt level? I understand that it'll be effective if a group of skilled workers make this point to Pakistani high commission.

Let me know if anyone agrees?

Regards,
JD

push_hsmp wrote:This is something which needs be taken up at the Government to Government level. You guys should approach the Pakistan High Commission in UK and send petition to Govt. of Pakistan as well.

adnantps · Post by **adnantps** » Sat Apr 18, 2009 7:43 pm

akafridi wrote:hi adnantps
hopefully u will be fine. i have the same situation having MS(CS 2years) from FAST and BS(CS 4 years) from AIOU. I m Planning to send my Degrees to NARIC for Equ. Could you please give me the email or some other contact of ur friends who has send their degrees for Equ to NARIC, so i will have some better idea. I will be happy to hear u at my email at azamafridi@hotmail.com , I will be waiting ur responce. thank u. Infact HEC assure me that abt the Equ to master and ask me to contact us if some problem at NARIC. I even can forward their case to HEC if they are willing.
Thanks

This is some positive sign that HEC has given assurance that its equivalent to masters;
i'll give my friends email address to you.

Please do post about yr case outcome and your correspondence with HEC.

If it is indeed the case that none of paksitans degree is equivalenty to UK masters; then we can contact the high comission; and ill try to be the first to send them the case.
http://www.pakmission-uk.gov.pk/HC/ContactUs.asp

yasa · Post by **yasa** » Sun Apr 19, 2009 12:04 pm

One should not loose hope. The above comments are preety helpful for those who r affected by new rules.
Government to Government level is the best solution rather than going into petty arguments about media and others.

akafridi · Post by **akafridi** » Mon Apr 20, 2009 6:32 am

hi adnan,
Iwill get dgree of MS in late may 2009 and only than will be able to send it to NARIC. I ur friend got certificate from NARIC , just send me its scaned Copy + copy of MS degree so i could start prsuing with HEC from now at earliest possible. The official at HEC told me that they have almost daily corespondence with NARIC and he was sure that it will be equivalent to UK MS.
Please send the above to me so i could talk to them. I m based at Islamabad, so it is not much difficult for me to have face to face meeting with HEC official.

blue.olive · Post by **blue.olive** » Mon Apr 20, 2009 9:32 am

Fellows, instead of jumping to the conclusion , why not someone having four year graduation along with a master degree apply to UK NARIC and get equivalnce certificate.

I am sure if you explain everything , means number of years in graducation and in master they should issue equivlt cert. to Master degree.

Its only one of cost and you will manage to clear all the ambiguity regarding you application.

blue.olive · Post by **blue.olive** » Mon Apr 20, 2009 9:41 am

akafridi wrote:hi adnan,
Iwill get dgree of MS in late may 2009 and only than will be able to send it to NARIC. I ur friend got certificate from NARIC , just send me its scaned Copy + copy of MS degree so i could start prsuing with HEC from now at earliest possible. The official at HEC told me that they have almost daily corespondence with NARIC and he was sure that it will be equivalent to UK MS.
Please send the above to me so i could talk to them. I m based at Islamabad, so it is not much difficult for me to have face to face meeting with HEC official.

Thats what i was trying to explain , DO NOT LOSE THE HOPE
Akafridi offers exclnt support
Its worth trying rather then presume smth without reasonable efforts
Please try to contact UK Naric, write to them , explain them you scanerio and let them answer.
Good Luck

akafridi · Post by **akafridi** » Mon Apr 20, 2009 11:49 am

Hi,
My point is HEC spend lot of money on higher education and university reform and no dought they did as well. Large number of students persuing Phd's in pakistan now. If i get one such non-equivalence case , I will directly go to Dr. Sohail Naqvi (Exective Director HEC) and will explain him the senarion. If we keep on sleeping today NARIC and tomorrow may b some other insitute degrade our degrees. we even could pressurize HEC to persue the matter and come up with some clear arguments.
Thnak u.

tipu20 · Post by **tipu20** » Mon Apr 20, 2009 12:33 pm

Hi All,

Let me contribute some samples in this discussion, Below are some overview and comments /corrections are welcome.

Overview of Pakistan Education System (As per my understanding).
Normally pre HEC days a bachelors degree in pakistan was 3 years or 4 year program and Master Degree was 2 years program.

Now in Pakistan the Bachelors Degree is 4 year (HEC recognized) and Master degree is still 2 years program.

UK Education System.

4 Years Education = Bachelors Degree
1 Year Education = Master Degree Full time.

(Source http://www.reading.ac.uk/Study/courses/ ... erging.asp
http://www.reading.ac.uk/Study/courses/ ... siness.asp http://www.reading.ac.uk/Study/courses/ ... netics.asp
)

Few Degrees in UK need 2 years full time study.

Now let's join them togather.

Current Total time a student spend in Pakistan for Master degree

4 + 2 = 6 Years = Master Degree (MS / MSCS)
3 + 2 = 5 Years = Master Degree (MSc/MA)

UK some degrees ( as per above link) a master degree holder study time will be

4 + 2 = 6 Years = Master Degree
4 + 1 = 5 Years = Master Degree

Looking at the above when someone from Paksitan have done a master degree it should be equalant to Master but UK NARIC does not agree with this, I have spend 2 hours explaining them but ended up my 3 year BCS + 2 Year MCS being classified as equal to BA standard .

Officially someone from HEC need to explain them about Pakistan Education system and credit hours student spend studying and demand the requirments to fill the gaps & agree to some middle way for all of the future candidates.

When it comes to course subject i don't see much difference between Science courses in UK and Pakistan

Regards,
Tipu

tipu20 · Post by **tipu20** » Mon Apr 20, 2009 12:48 pm

Another link for someone who is going to speak to HEC

http://www.naric.org.uk/documents/code% ... dology.pdf

Above is the link which explain how NARIC evaluate. someone from HEC need to need to review this and match them up with Pakistan Education system and understand which degrees fall under the criteria above and open the discussion with NARIC so NARIC can provide the proper evaluation.

Regards,
Tipu

yasa · Post by **yasa** » Mon Apr 20, 2009 1:07 pm

Look guys.. HEC should ve known by know about equivalent policy rite.. Have they done anything on their own? The answer is no. Dont u think that many of students from proper institutions in Pakistan have done NARIC and after being rejected they went to HEC but what is the result....
Some years back UGC now HEC rejected Greenwich University degree in Pakistan because of its curriculum. I guess they were not offering Pakistan Studies etc so now is it the pay back time? It is all and all up to HEC to liaise with NARIC otherwise there is no way out.

blue.olive · Post by **blue.olive** » Tue Apr 21, 2009 10:19 am

tipu20 wrote:Another link for someone who is going to speak to HEC

http://www.naric.org.uk/documents/code% ... dology.pdf

Above is the link which explain how NARIC evaluate. someone from HEC need to need to review this and match them up with Pakistan Education system and understand which degrees fall under the criteria above and open the discussion with NARIC so NARIC can provide the proper evaluation.

Regards,
Tipu

It was quite interesting and informative document tipu20
Thanks for sharing

visitor2 · Post by **visitor2** » Tue Apr 21, 2009 9:43 pm

Dear All,

My friend has got a simple BA and two master degree s( in mathematics and business administration) each of two years. Will he qualify under the changed rules? Please advise.

Other elements of criteria are no problem for him, as he is earning handsome salary.

Thank you for your time

tipu20 · Post by **tipu20** » Wed Apr 22, 2009 5:00 pm

visitor2 wrote:Dear All,

My friend has got a simple BA and two master degree s( in mathematics and business administration) each of two years. Will he qualify under the changed rules? Please advise.

Other elements of criteria are no problem for him, as he is earning handsome salary.

Thank you for your time

Your Friend need to put his qualification into points calculator to get the answer.
http://www.bia.homeoffice.gov.uk/pointscalculator

Regards

Vanadil · Post by **Vanadil** » Wed Apr 22, 2009 5:08 pm

adnantps wrote:Im not amused by this comment about hazardous countries;please refrain from making senseless comments when u havent visited the country's metro cities and professional hubs. It's the media that makes a country hazardous/safe....

I think it is genrally accepted that Pakistan is an unsafe place at the moment. Given the many recent events alone, it's hard to compare it to a 1st world country's level of secruity. So hardly senseless...

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Is paksitan unoffcially out of tier 1( highly skilled)?

Is paksitan unoffcially out of tier 1( highly skilled)?

HMSP for Pakistani Nationals