query regarding Irish passport for infant

[vkapoor]

I am an Irish citizen by naturalisation. I acquired this in 2006. I _DO NOT_ have any other ancestral connections with Ireland and my wife is non-EU.
Currently I am residing in UK. My baby was born 2 months back in UK.

My question is :
Will my baby be eligible for Irish citizenship?

Please let me know.

Thanks in advance.

[tom4]

Yes, he is an irish citizen now because his father was an irish citizen when he was born.

[Obie]

He is also a British Citizen. As his father is an Irish national resident in the UK

[JAJ]

Yes, he is an irish citizen now because his father was an irish citizen when he was born.

He is NOT an Irish citizen automatically as his Irish parent was not born in Ireland or Northern Ireland.

However, he can be registered as an Irish citizen upon application.

He is also a British citizen, but steps should be taken immediately to prove this by obtaining a British passport.

[Obie]

Jaj, i understand there are formalities to be met before the child can obtain both citizenship, nevertheless he is entitle to both of them.

[JAJ]

Jaj, i understand there are formalities to be met before the child can obtain both citizenship, nevertheless he is entitle to both of them.

Once again. Child is not an Irish citizen, but can become an Irish citizen if an application is made.

Child is a British citizen automatically.

There is a difference.

[Obie]

Once again. Child is not an Irish citizen, but can become an Irish citizen if an application is made.

Child is a British citizen automatically.

There is a difference.

I don't want us to go into semantics mate. But i can't seem to find any differences whatsoever.

Regardless of whatever way you construct the argument, the child is entitle to Irish citizenship, albeit his/her parent has to make an application for that entitlement to be facilitated.

Just like one of the parents would have to show they are Irish Citizen resident in the UK at the time of their child's birth, for the child British Citizenship to be facilitated.

[tom4]

Yes, he is an irish citizen now because his father was an irish citizen when he was born.

He is NOT an Irish citizen automatically as his Irish parent was not born in Ireland or Northern Ireland.
However, he can be registered as an Irish citizen upon application.

Oops, that's right, you must first register him in the foreign births register. Section 7 of the act makes a sweeping statement in subsection 1 but then makes an exception later on (until they change it, yet again) - should have read the whole thing.

[ca.funke]

Once again. Child is not an Irish citizen, but can become an Irish citizen if an application is made.

Child is a British citizen automatically.

There is a difference.

Hi JAJ,

just to understand it fully:

Does this mean that:

The child is automatically a UK-citizen (=from day 1) simply because it´s born in the UK AND one parent is Irish.

AND

The child is ENTITLED to Irish citizenship from day one, but this is only conferred after a corresponding application?

Thus, if no further steps are taken, the child would remain British only?

If so, how much time is there to register/apply for the Irish citizenship?

(If all this is so I´d apply for Irish citizenship ASAP, to make sure this isn´t changed at some stage...)

[vkapoor]

Folks,
Thanks for your replies so far.
I just got on to the Irish Embassy and they said that he can obtain Irish citizenship by Registration in the Foreign Births Register. He'll be an Irish citizen from the time this is registered in the Foreign Births Register. He's not automatically entitled to Irish citizenship because although I have Irish citizenship I was not born in Ireland nor do I have any other ancestral links with Ireland. Additionally he himself is not born in Ireland.
Can someone clarify how he is eligible for British citizenship? I have been resident here only for 3 years or so. Can anyone point me to a weblink or any info on how he's a British citizen automatically.

[Ben]

Hi JAJ,

just to understand it fully:

Does this mean that:

The child is automatically a UK-citizen (=from day 1) simply because it´s born in the UK AND one parent is Irish.

AND

The child is ENTITLED to Irish citizenship from day one, but this is only conferred after a corresponding application?

Thus, if no further steps are taken, the child would remain British only?

If so, how much time is there to register/apply for the Irish citizenship?

(If all this is so I´d apply for Irish citizenship ASAP, to make sure this isn´t changed at some stage...)

This is correct.

There is a crucial difference between is and entitled to become.

[Obie]

There is a crucial difference between is and entitled to become.

Thanks a million Ben. That is the point i was trying to make with Jaj.

[Ben]

There is a crucial difference between is and entitled to become.

Thanks a million Ben. That is the point i was trying to make with Jaj.

Erm, I think JAJ was trying to make that point to you..

Jaj, i understand there are formalities to be met before the child can obtain both citizenship, nevertheless he is entitle to both of them.

Once again. Child is not an Irish citizen, but can become an Irish citizen if an application is made.

Child is a British citizen automatically.

There is a difference.

[Obie]

My point is entitlement to and not automatic acquisition of.

I specifically stated that when necessary formalities have been met, the child is entitle to both citizenship.

[vkapoor]

I still don't get the point reg. British citizenship. Can someone point me to any information regarding this.

[Ben]

I still don't get the point reg. British citizenship. Can someone point me to any information regarding this.

Child in question is automatically a British citizen from birth. You can apply for an British passport for the child through the normal channels.

[calai]

How could the child be a British citizen from birth? His parents have not been living in the UK for more than 5 years and I assume they do not have ILR. I hope that child can be a British citizen by birth.

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/sitec ... de_mn1.pdf

Automatic acquisition of British citizenship

Children who have automatically acquired British citizenship do not need to be registered.There are two ways a child can automatically be a British citizen without needing toregister.

1 British citizenship otherwise than by descentA child born in the UK to parents one or both of whom are
• British citizens, or
• are settled in the UK at the time the child is born

Children of EEA nationals

• A child born in the United Kingdom before 2/10/2000 to an EEA national parent willbe a British citizen if the parent was exercising a treaty right at the time of the birth.
• A child born in the United Kingdom between 2/10/2000 and 30 April 2006 to anEEA national parent will only be a British citizen if the parent had indefinite leave toremain in the UK at the time of the birth. (This does not apply to EEA nationalswith an unconditional right of residence, such as retired people or someone who isunable to work because of incapacity).
• A child born in the United Kingdom to an EEA national after 30 April 2006 will be aBritish citizen if their parent had been in the United Kingdom exercising a treatyright for more than 5 years or has indefinite leave to remain.

[Obie]

• are settled in the UK at the time the child is born

Irish citizens who are resident in the UK are considered settled as if they hold an ILR. They have a distinguished status from other EEA nationals who have to meet the five years resident requirement.

The child will not qualify except the Irish parent is living or settled in the UK at the time of birth.

Have a look at this link, it provides a clearer picture.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_na ... h_citizens

[JAJ]

How could the child be a British citizen from birth? His parents have not been living in the UK for more than 5 years and I assume they do not have ILR. I hope that child can be a British citizen by birth.

Standard EEA rules do not apply to Irish citizens (well, they do, but there are additional provisions that Irish citizens can take advantage of):

5.3 ... Citizens of the Irish Republic, whether exercising EEA free movement rights or not, are not normally subject to any form of immigration control on arrival in the UK because of the Republic’s inclusion in the Common Travel Area (s.1(3), Immigration Act 1971)

and ...

8.5 The 2006 Regulations do not affect the position of EEA nationals entitled to remain indefinitely on some other basis, for example because they have been granted indefinite leave to remain under the Immigration Rules, are entitled by virtue of diplomatic status to exemption from UK immigration control or because, as Irish nationals, they benefit under the Common Travel Area provisions. Persons in these categories should continue to be regarded as free from any restriction under the immigration laws on the period for which they may remain.

Hence, as long as Irish parent is living in Britain, and not just visiting, the UK born child is automatically a British citizen.

There shouldn't be any problem getting a British passport for the child, but it ought to be done immediately as providing the necessary evidence will be harder later on.

If there is a problem with the Passport Office not understanding the law, the Home Office will confirm the child's British citizenship in writing for a fee of GBP75.

[strongbow]

@JAJ
Which documents are you quoting the above sections 5.3 and 8.5 from?
Do you have an online link?
Thanks.

[Ben]

@JAJ
Which documents are you quoting the above sections 5.3 and 8.5 from?
Do you have an online link?
Thanks.

http://www.bia.homeoffice.gov.uk/siteco ... iew=Binary

[D15]

Hi vkapoor,

I am in a very similar situation to yours and was hoping if you can advice me about the result of your application: was it accepted & you got an Irish passport for your child? how long did it take for the Irish Embassy to proceed with the application? what was the required papers?

Thanks for your help.