Eu Treaty Rights Visa Scandal

[Visa Victims]

I am a Dutch citizen and I married my Non-EU husband in Ireland on 2nd February 2009 (about 1 year ago). We applied for my husband’s EU Treaty rights (free movement) the same month (February 2009). I have been employed in Ireland before we applied for the case. Still, we got a refusal from the department saying ‘I am not exercising my EU treaty rights’. This was probably because I switched jobs, since the company where I previously worked closed down. However, I did inform them of the matter on time. Even then, they refused our case 1 month after I had informed them of this change (and provided them with full new employment and contact details). We immediately applied for a review in August 2009 and have been waiting for an outcome ever since.

Is there anybody who can help us?? We have been waiting for over one year and all that time my husband has been unemployed because he legally has no status now in Ireland (his temporary stamp 4, which we got because of the application, expired on 22nd of August 2009). Before this my husband had stamp 2, being a student, but this was replaced for a stamp 4 of 6 months when we did our application.

We went to the GNIB for another temporary residence card (which we also got the first time during our application process) to await the outcome of the review but they simply said that they are not allowed to do that without a letter from the Visa department (which seems to be impossible).

Is there anyone who can advise us on this critical matter?

[archigabe]

Try giving the Immigrant Council of Ireland a call or the MRCI

[zafarzafar]

Immigration coucil of ireland is the best.
there phone number is : Telephone 01 674 0202
Email: admin@immigrantcouncil.ie

[sofinette]

I am a Dutch citizen and I married my Non-EU husband in Ireland on 2nd February 2009 (about 1 year ago). We applied for my husband’s EU Treaty rights (free movement) the same month (February 2009). I have been employed in Ireland before we applied for the case. Still, we got a refusal from the department saying ‘I am not exercising my EU treaty rights’. This was probably because I switched jobs, since the company where I previously worked closed down. However, I did inform them of the matter on time. Even then, they refused our case 1 month after I had informed them of this change (and provided them with full new employment and contact details). We immediately applied for a review in August 2009 and have been waiting for an outcome ever since.

Is there anybody who can help us?? We have been waiting for over one year and all that time my husband has been unemployed because he legally has no status now in Ireland (his temporary stamp 4, which we got because of the application, expired on 22nd of August 2009). Before this my husband had stamp 2, being a student, but this was replaced for a stamp 4 of 6 months when we did our application.

We went to the GNIB for another temporary residence card (which we also got the first time during our application process) to await the outcome of the review but they simply said that they are not allowed to do that without a letter from the Visa department (which seems to be impossible).

Is there anyone who can advise us on this critical matter?

You mean that you are waiting for the review since August 09 ?
I'm very afraid now cause I think I'm going to be in the same case . I'm the EU citizen, my husband the non EU. I'm working here but we get refusal cause we didn't provide them enough proof of residency in the state they mentionned that we didn't provide them the letter of registration with PRTB . That 's sounds ridiculous as they have the lease , my bank statements , they can see on it that I receive my salary, pay the rent ... and anyway the landlord doesn't want to register us with PRTB ... We are going to appeal but I don't want to wait so long again

I went to the citizen info , who transfered my case to the council, who already told me that I probably will have to take a lawyer as they cannot really use the PRTB letter to refuse an application ... That's a shame to be honest , I never seen anything like that before !

[Visa Victims]

well thats the way it is..
i pray that u shouldn't suffer in the same position where we were. immigration council and other organization are only help you to write a letter nothing else. this department is a night mare. they thinks that they are GOD
we have no idea where to go and what to do ..
thats the worst thing which can ever happened ...

[sofinette]

well thats the way it is..
i pray that u shouldn't suffer in the same position where we were. immigration council and other organization are only help you to write a letter nothing else. this department is a night mare. they thinks that they are GOD
we have no idea where to go and what to do ..
thats the worst thing which can ever happened ...

When We received the refusal , they also put in the same mail another document saying that he have 3 choices : 1. leave the state voluntary, 2. deportation , 3. make representation to maintain his stay in the state .
So we need to appeal for the review and in the meantime respond a this 2nd letter. Did you get them both as well ?
I thought that making representions could give him the right to stay but also to continue to work in Ireland , am I wrong ?
The danger of that is , if they don't approve his saty in the stay he's going to be deported without consetment.

[whata1da]

I have had the same thing happen to me. I am non-EU and my husband is British. He changed jobs and they cancelled my application for EU treaty rights, even though there was a lapse of like two weeks in between his jobs. According to EU treaty rights freedom of movement act, an EU national can be unemployed up to a maximum of 6 months in a member state and still seen as exercising his/her rights in that state. However, the DOJ just politely ignores this little fact.

We applied for a review on 9 October 2009 and we are still waiting for a reply. Whenever we contact them to enquire about how much longer it will take before we get a decision, all they have to say is "our office will be in contact in due course".

I think it's ridiculous that after waiting an initial 6 months, one has to wait another 6 months for them to review ones application, when I am sure it can be resolved in a matter of weeks.

Without an immigration status, life is tough for us non-EU citizens. I can't work (and it's driving me insane) My husband and I cannot travel to the UK to visit his family or anywhere in Europe...we cannot even dare think to travel across the border to Northern Ireland due to my stamp 4 being expired.

Sofinette I really feel for you as I can imagine what it is like trying to get that letter from the PRTB that simply does not exist and frankly is beyond your control. I do think that in the midst of the current economic climate they are trying to reduce the number of non-EU citizens into Ireland and are therefore picking holes in every pocket.

Hoping to see some light at the end of the tunnel, as I know all of you are too.

[sofinette]

[quote="whata1da"]
Without an immigration status, life is tough for us non-EU citizens. I can't work (and it's driving me insane) My husband and I cannot travel to the UK to visit his family or anywhere in Europe...we cannot even dare think to travel across the border to Northern Ireland due to my stamp 4 being expired.
quote]

That's why I want to do everything I can to avoid that . We was waiting for his card to visit my family in France , to go on holidays ... I wanted to make 1 or 2 months break ( I feel very tired , I work since years) , I use to travel at least once every two months, to wait 6 months was already challenging for us .And in the other hand, I know my husband very well, he's going to be crazy if he loose his job and cannot work during the appeal period. All this together is going to create problems and tension in our couple and the result will be to decide to move somewhere else to preserve our marriage or in the worst senario , to decide a separation ...
If we look at our options , here they are :
If we go to the US, My husband was leaving in US for the past 10 years , he was green card holder . As he left the US since more than 6 months , the american authorities has full right to don't allow him to go back . Even if by chance they don't stop him at the airport , it's gonna take 3/5 years for me to have have an immigration status as my husband is not an US citizen (he never wanted to apply for).
If we decide to go in France , I left the country 2 years ago and I never regretted it . Firstable my husband doesn't speak French , so it's going to be very very hard to get a job . We are going to be force to live with my parents for few months as it's not easy in France to get an appartment if you don't have a permanent position and if you didn't worked over there the last 2 years . How frustrating to even think to live with my parents even for a short period ! and where my husband is going to find a job ? this option is not better than the other .
Last choice , as my husband is a Turkish National and I am myself double national French /Turkish . We can go in Turkey without any immigration problem, but I don't want this option cause I never lived over there, and my husband left the country since 10 years . What we are going to do in Turkey ? It is hard to admit that we are going to be reduct to live in Turkey because I didn't provide the PRTB f... letter and forgot to send my husband bank statement's.
And more than everything I think it's UNFAIR !
Except this appeal letter we have to deal with the deportation letter that they sent us in the same mail which is even more serious and problematik . Why ? Why did they sent us this deportation letter when they don't even know if we are going to appeal or not ? What have we done to deserve that ? are we criminal or something ? a danger for the state ?

I went to a lawyer to deal with the appeal and the deportation letter . I even agreed to go in court to defend my case . But what he's going to do first is to make the appeal given them 14 days to review their decision . If they don't ... we will have to make a choice , to go to the court or to leave the country . I will prefer to go to the court as I feel that any other option is going to destroy our live, and why should I agree with an unfair decision, I want to defend my rights . but I 'm not alone to decide, and my husband don't really want to stay here without an immigration status .

[Visa Victims]

well we should do complain against the DOJ. i don't know why they are tring to be GOD...

[boxbo]

well thats the way it is..
i pray that u shouldn't suffer in the same position where we were. immigration council and other organization are only help you to write a letter nothing else. this department is a night mare. they thinks that they are GOD
we have no idea where to go and what to do ..
thats the worst thing which can ever happened ...

The same story and have the same feelings!
Went everywhere and still sitting waiting for the answer for the refusal!
In the Solvit centre they sad that it the bigining of Feb. DOJ was looking on the refusals that they recived in June, so Visa Victims we still need to wait ........;(

[Visa Victims]

i think DOJ believes on jangle law and thats the law they are using for take decision for our cases ...
i wrote mail to solvit but i got no response.

[sovtek]

Sofinette I really feel for you as I can imagine what it is like trying to get that letter from the PRTB that simply does not exist and frankly is beyond your control. I do think that in the midst of the current economic climate they are trying to reduce the number of non-EU citizens into Ireland and are therefore picking holes in every pocket.

That's exactly what they are doing. Immigrants are easy targets for the incompetent, sadistic fucks that run this country. They blame the immigrants for the recession when it is their fault and their friends the bankers. Now they are using excuses like "sham" marriages to try and get rid of as many immigrants as possible. Ahern said it himself "immigrants must work". Otherwise we are surplus people to be gotten rid of.
I'm sick of it myself and am, along with a group of people, fighting this rubbish. Anyone want to help let me know by PM. Will be out front of GNIB probably next week.

[Visa Victims]

what kind of steps u r planning to take ..?
i am fed up with all that bull shit make by shit DOJ

[whata1da]

Anyone hear anything from DOJ yet??? I've been waiting for nearly 6months now since submitting my application for a review.

I'm very tempted to send my story to the papers and see how quickly the DOJ responds. Before arriving in Ireland I had a career in IT and now since not working in the sector for over a year, my skills have become outdated and my husband and I have to survive on his salary alone. As much as he does not complain about the situation, I feel frustrated as I've always had a job.

The DOJ is messing with our lives, relationships and futures and all we are to them are reference numbers. It does not even take a month to get a reply when applying for a UK spouse visa, why the Irish take 6 months, I have no idea

[Visa Victims]

we have been in this ridiculous situation since almost from 8 months
and no body is hearing us
my husband is an electronics eng who is only sitting at home all the time because his visa is expire and he cant do any job and my salary is too less

we have no idea that what's going on and what the hell this DOJ wants from us
u r right, its really being difficult situation
i can only say sorry for you

now we heard that DOJ will send police in ur home to check u and at ur spouse's job to investigate
i don't know what these people wants to prove

[boxbo]

I m going to local TD

[IrishTom]

The press will be all over the passport office in Molesworth Street for the next few days. If you guys organised a protest outside the GNIB on Burgh Quay, the lazy journos might just pop around for the photo opportunity. Kill two birds with one stone, if you will.

Just saying, like. Might not get a better opportunity to highlight your cause in the immediate future.

[IrishTom]

I m going to local TD

With respect, he wont give a rats mule. Why? Because you cannot vote.

Sorry if that sounds harsh,boxbo, but thats how TDs do business.

[sofinette]

HI there,

Just to give an update regarding my situation .

The Inis didn't accept to review our case within 2 weeks and they didn't want to extend my husband's stamp4 as it was requested by my lawyer. the reason is that whe should have been able to provide them the letter of registration from PRTB during the 6 months where the application was in process (which is true , we should have been able to provide them that in 6 months , but we didn't know that it was so important for them ).
At least the stopped the deportation thing as we applied for the review.

Now two choices :
1. I accept the situation even if it seems to be unfair for me . my husband won't work during the review process and we'll live only with my salary (we could pursue them in justice in the same time)
2. We leave the country (but to go where ? ... no idea )

That's sounds terrible , I feel this decision as if it was a joke . they are playing with our lives , and there is nothing that we can do about that . Unfortunately, we couldn't send them this PRTB letter and even if it is not necessary to grant a residency card to my husband , it was required and we shouldn't have done this mistake.

Pfff , we are going to live and since now, our plan are going to choose a new destination .

[IrishTom]

2. We leave the country (but to go where ? ... no idea )

How is your own nation fairing out during the recession?

[sofinette]

2. We leave the country (but to go where ? ... no idea )

How is your own nation fairing out during the recession?

No idea, I left France since 2 years and never regretted it .

[Visa Victims]

2. We leave the country (but to go where ? ... no idea )

dose ur husband has visa i mean how can u travel from ireland to any other EU state?

[boxbo]

[/quote]With respect, he wont give a rats mule. Why? Because you cannot vote.

Sorry if that sounds harsh,boxbo, but thats how TDs do business.[/quote]

I know that very well Irish Tom, that is why I` ll there not alone, but with my spouse who can vote!

[whata1da]

Hi everyone

Just thought I'd post an update to let you know that I just received my letter from DOJ and my review has been successful.

It's been 7 months since they cancelled my application for EU treaty rights as my hubby changed jobs and we had not informed them of the change, but with perserveranceatus, lots of additional documentation, many letters written to the DOJ about my application status and most importantly support from my husband, we finally have a positive result.

I wish all of you the very best as you await the outcome of your reviews.