Gov't to scrap ICFNs, but holders don't have ppt stamps

[The Station Agent]

Anyone know what the government proposes to do about the thousands of ICFN holders who don't have stamps in their passports and so will not be able to prove their right to be here if the ICFN is scrapped?

And what kind of f***wit at UKBA decided it would be a good idea not to bother stamping passports for ICFN holders?

[MPH80]

Where have you picked up that ICFNs are going to be scrapped?

Last report I heard - British National Identity cards were going - but not ICFN.

[geriatrix]

No. The UK Border Agency (UKBA) will continue to issue biometric residence permits to non-EU foreign nationals.

European law requires non-EU foreign nationals to be provided with biometric residence permits.

They are separate from the programme to introduce the UK National Identity Card and the Identification Card for EEA nationals, and are issued under entirely different legislation.

The biometric data is not kept on the National Identity Register.

regards

[The Station Agent]

http://www.workpermit.com/news/2010-05- ... grants.htm

However, today the Guardian are saying the ICFN scheme will remain. But last week they were all saying the whole thing was being scrapped, including ICFN. Some clarity is required, I think.

[Markie]

it's only the ID cards for british citizens that will be scrapped. check the UKBA website announcement last 27May.

Where have you picked up that ICFNs are going to be scrapped?

Last report I heard - British National Identity cards were going - but not ICFN.

[tt]

The original intent, I believe, was that the Identity Cards for Foreign Nationals (ICFNs) would be implemented for ALL limited leave to remain categories by April 2011, and 90% of all immigrant categories by 2015.

I assume the remaining 10% would be those on ILR prior to a certain date, who have not gone for/don't want citizenship.

Now... the options are to discontinue the ICFN implementation, leaving those with ICFNs with valid cards, but continuing to issue vignettes in passports for all other categories... or, to change the timetable of implementation, thereby extending the period of time of implementation to beyond 2011/2015... or, to drop the requirement for ILR/Permanent Resident holders altogether... or, go ahead as before...
or, indeed, infact go for unexpected and really do totally scrap the Identity Card for Foreign Nationals. ("Named OISC advisors" have an article about it today)

Was the ID Card for EU Nationals (living in the UK) bound up in the British Citizen ID Card legislation? Or is that something the government can still go ahead with if it really wanted to, I wonder?
Have EU Nationals living in the UK found out one way or the other yet?

[INSIDER]

And what kind of f***wit at UKBA decided it would be a good idea not to bother stamping passports for ICFN holders?

Who said this is the case.? As far as I know such passports are still stamped, the ICFN number is normally hand-written at the top of the stamp.

[geriatrix]

And what kind of f***wit at UKBA decided it would be a good idea not to bother stamping passports for ICFN holders?

Who said this is the case.? As far as I know such passports are still stamped, the ICFN number is normally hand-written at the top of the stamp.

You need a refresher on ICFN.


regards

[PaperPusher]

Insider is talking about stamping, you know, with an ink stamp. ICFNs have replaced vignettes, not stamps.

[geriatrix]

In that case, it is me who needs a refresher!
I assumed Insider meant vignette when he said stamp. Wrong! My mistake!



regards

[PaperPusher]

Station Agent meant vignette but said stamp it appears.

[The Station Agent]

I have done 3 Tier 2 cases recently where the holder was given an ICFN but no stamp or vignette was placed in the passport. I think that's mental because people will now have to put their ICFN with every visa application they make for other countries (because to apply for a US visa for instance, in London, the US Embassy want proof you are living here legally). It just seems completely daft - why would they not stamp the passport too?

[geriatrix]

Let's be clear on one thing - are you referring to a vignette (visa) or an ink stamp, when you say "stamping the passport" or "stamp in the passport"?

ICFN replaces the leave to enter / remain (visa) vignette in the passport. People issued with ICFN do not have a vignette in their passport as details of the leave to remain (visa) are embedded in to the ICFN.


regards

[Mr Rusty]

Seems like a dialogue of the deaf has developed here.

The OP raised two original questions, both of which may be based on false premises:
1) How will foreign nationals who have been issued with i/dcards be able to prove their status if said cards are withdrawn?
The i/d card scheme for UK nationals is to be scrapped, but there's been no suggestion that this will happen to ICFNs. Even if it did, they'd have to be replaced with stick-in vignettes, wouldn't they?
2) Why don't i/d card-holders get entry stamps in their passports any time they arrive in the UK?
Insider says they do, with the card number written on the stamp - pretty much the same as US green=card system, surely?

I accept that the logic of requiring some foreign nationals to have i/d cards has pretty much been blown away by the collapse of the scheme to force them onto an unwilling UK population, but it's not much of an issue really.

[The Station Agent]

But why not put the vignette in the passport? Fair enough to have the ICFN scheme but why don't they vignette the passport? The fact they don't means that people HAVE to show the ICFN whenever they travel or apply for a visa for another country. I personally know of someone who is here on a Tier 2 ICFN and applied for a Spanish visa but was turned down because the Spanish consulate didn't recognise his ICFN and said because his passport was not endorsed with his leave conditions they could not grant him a visa.

If the government is not scrapping the ICFN scheme then my original point of this thread is pretty much null and void, but workpermit.com (the sponsors of this forum) said the ICFN was being scrapped which is what has led to that misunderstanding.

But the UKBA should vignette the passport as they used to, not force the people to travel with their passport and ID card. An ID card is much easier to mislay.