EU immigration near impossible...

[Dash_of_Salt]

I'm a Canadian citizen, and I've grown tired of living here. Every year they cut more out of the arts budget, not to mention we are following in American footsteps. I don't like the North American mentality at all. I've been to Europe, love it, and would die to live there.

After extensive research though I realized it may remain only a dream. For one, I'm not in a competitive market (newspaper/blogging etc.), meaning someone over there can definitely do any job I can do (thus making it impossible for me to get a work permit). Second, because I can't get that work permit I can't get a long-term stay visa. Of course becaus I can't get that I can never become a permanent resident.

Mind you, I have no familial ties to Europe and so naturalization is the only option I have. I'm also no elite, so simply requesting and exemption would get me laughed at.

Does this mean my only truly remaining option is illegal immigration? I'm willing to do this, however if it can be done legally I'd prefer that.

[avjones]

Do you have a grandparent who was born in the UK, or in Ireland?

Do you meet the "highly-skilled" criteria?

How old are you?

[Dash_of_Salt]

I'm 22, and no, I'm pretty sure none of my grandparents had a citizenship in any European country. I'm also not considered what they would call "highly-skilled". I have a Bachelors degree in Film, but again, a job as a film critic or a small scale job in the film industry probably wouldn't cut it.

That's the point I'm trying to make though. Immigration to Europe really seems impossible for someone in my position, which would also include a large number of other people.

[avjones]

Might be worth double-checking if any of your grandparents was born in a European country, perhaps emigrated to Canada very young?

Otherwise, have you considered the Tier 5 youth programme? It's the re-named working holiday visa. 2 years. You can work 12 months out of that 2 years. UK only.

245ZK. Requirements for entry clearance

To qualify for entry clearance as a Tier 5 (Youth Mobility Scheme) Temporary Migrant, an applicant must meet the requirements listed below. However, whether or not the requirements listed below are met, if a citizen of a country listed in Appendix G makes an application for entry clearance which, if granted, would mean that the annual allocation of places under this route for citizens of that country would be exceeded, the application will be refused. The applicant will also be refused if the requirements listed below are not met. Canada is listed in Appendix G.

Requirements:

(a) The applicant must not fall for refusal under the general grounds for refusal.

(b) The applicant must be:

(i) a citizen of a country listed in Appendix G to these Rules, or

......

(c) The applicant must have a minimum of 40 points under paragraphs 101 to 104 of Appendix A.

(d) The applicant must have a minimum of 10 points under paragraphs 6 to 7 of Appendix C.

(e) The applicant must have no children under the age of 18 who are either living with him or for whom he is financially responsible.

(f) The applicant must not previously have spent time in the UK as a Working Holidaymaker or a Tier 5 (Youth Mobility Scheme) Temporary Migrant.

245ZL. Period and conditions of grant

Entry clearance will be granted for a period of 2 years subject to the following conditions:

(a) no recourse to public funds,

(b) registration with the police, if this is required by paragraph 326 of these Rules,

To get the 40 points under Appendix A,you need to be from a particular country (Canada's fine) and be aged 18 to 31.

Under appendix C, you need to show you have £1,600 available to support yourself.

[Dash_of_Salt]

I have done extensive research into the Working Holiday Visa to countries all around Europe. I was most interested in the UK, Belgium, Ireland and Holland. However none of these offer renewals after the set amount of time, and I still wouldn't have spent enough time in the country to apply for permanent residence.

If that's the case, I would simply have to come back here at the end of the two years. First off because I have to be in Canada to apply for the work permit I would need to go further than the two years, and second because I still wouldn't have the target work required to justify a work permit.

[AxeZ]

Just get married to European chick..

[Dash_of_Salt]

I've actually been considering that lol. I wouldn't rely on my ability to get a legitimate wife though, so I'd probably have to pay a friend if I met someone over there on a Working Holiday Visa .

Any idea how much something like that would cost? (Sarcasm intended)

[MelC]

make life really easy, marry one from one EU state that lives and works in another!!!

SORTED

[hunpak]

are u guys seriously advising him to cheat the system.. do u have any idea due to this cheating with system how much the genuine people have to go through.

[Dash_of_Salt]

What's to say I'm not one of these genuine people? Under this system, should I not receive equal consideration? No, I don't receive any consideration whatsoever. Thus this system forces me into my only option, which also happens to be illegal. If you could offer me an alternative I'd gladly hear it.

[wunder]

A bad case of "grass is greener on the other side of the pond", as I can see. FYI, your description of "every year they cut more out of the arts budget, not to mention we are following in American footsteps" fits perfectly for most European countries too (and most definitely for UK).

What's to say I'm not one of these genuine people?

Because you are considering illegal immigration?

Under this system, should I not receive equal consideration?

You will receive equal consideration if you will apply for any visa/work permit.

Thus this system forces me into my only option, which also happens to be illegal.

No, the system forces you to another option - stay where you are. For foreigners life in Europe is not a right, it's an earned privilege.

[Dash_of_Salt]

Privelege? Canada has very leniant immigration terms. In fact, one need only prove he can support himself and he'll often find he ends up with a permanent residence. Not too mention the naturalization process can be waved off. Sure the housing issue isn't as prevalent here, but the jobs are just as hard to find. Europe is no holy grail, and why should you consider it privelege? I'm not saying it's a right either, but that doesn't mean I should be considering this a move "up the ladder". It's something that I should be able to be given an opportunity to justify, not simply be turned down before they even see my face.

I realize arts are being cut around the world, and I have no intention of finishing in UK. It's simply that I have to plan this perfectly if I'm going to end up somewhere I want.

Don't joke about the equal consideration bit. This system allows you to only get a work permit if no one else in all the EU can do your job. Again I say don't joke, as this system you say gives equal consideration is screaming "we say we give equal consideration, but you'd have to be an idiot to actually believe that, have you read our policies?"

Thanks, by choosing my only available option I'm no longer genuine? You have very elitist views of the world. I'm hoping most people in Europe are't as stringent about letting people in as you are. That's one thing I'll always agree Canada does best; open immigration.

Stay where I am? That's not an option my man. I see no appeal in staying in one country to work, live and die here. I intend to get out, and will do whatever I can. It would just be easier if I had the co-operation of some of the other "supposed" first world countries.

[MelC]

are u guys seriously advising him to cheat the system.. do u have any idea due to this cheating with system how much the genuine people have to go through.

the 2 "smileys" indicated it was a "JOKE"

as I have spent a YEAR YES A YEAR fighting to get my Non Eu spouse his entry visa that should have been issued within 4 weeks (as per directive)

and am still stranded in the Third country as the ferry comapny insist that his visa is tourist and he must comply with all schengen tourist regulations, our rental agreement is up here in the third country, our car has been here almost a year and once it goes over its "illegal" here and I will be fined, the DVLA now wnat my car to be permanently exported if I don't leave here within my "year", cahnces are that the accommodation and employment that were available in italy wont be by the time we get there IF we get there ~
No-one can tell me about how much "genuine" people have to go through, cos i could write a book!!

I would NEVER advocate illigal immigration NOR a "sham" marriage!

It was a joke! maybe i should have put this as there is no "sarcastic eye roll" which WOULD have been my first choice!

its always sad when people who genuinely want to emigrate do not fit in the neat little box, as their employment is not sought after or they don't have mega bucks in the bank!

[MelC]

Dash_of_Salt,

My grandfather emigrated to Canada in the 1920's, he returned a few times, hence i was born to one of the "UK" children.

I expect that my grandfather became a Canadian citizen or was naturalised, I don't really know, I will as the govt there to check that I think.
He died in canada, having not returned to the UK for 20 years. (1958)

Does that mean that I can go to canada? live in Canada? I have uncles aunts and cousins there, I also have my grandfathers borthers family there, 5 generations of them now!

Probably easier for me to go there by boat than the couple of hundred miles from here to italy!

[Dash_of_Salt]

Gaining permanent residence and a work permit in Canada can be as easy as finding sponsor. I'm pretty sure this sponsor doesn't even have to be direct family, it could be an intended girlfriend, uncle, aunt, great aunt, sometimes very good friends can even cut it lol. The only difficulty in this entire process is because it's so easy, there are ridiculous amounts of applicants, meaning the time to process said application may take a bit longer than in other countries.

Contrast those laws with Europe, and they are on completely different sides of the spectrum. Until yesterday my only option was to go over there and attempt to navigate the 14 years it takes before I can apply for a citizenship based off illegal naturalization. That or pay someone to get married.

Personally I feel no qualms over doing this. My country is leniant and will allow anyone with some time and a desire to be over her. Not the case for Europe, and so I'm willing to go around the system, which IMO is quite wrong anyway.

Luckily though I found out my grandfather was born and lived in Nottingham for 5 years. This means I can get a work permit very very easily now.

This really feels ridiculous though, how after one phone call I go from near impossible, to almost impossible to be rejected. Nothing about me changed, just some minor fact from a grandfather who dies before I was born. RIDICULOUS!

[MelC]

My grandfather died before I was born, I would like to visit his grave in all seriousness, and the farm he had etc, and meet the family i only have contact with via the internet!

Glad you found a legal way to see what its like in the EU, The penalties are there for illigal immigration but not used quickly enough! heres hoping you won't EVER be in that situation!

[Fairtrade]

With all do respect.... Canada is a BIG COUNTRY (more than twice the size of the European Union!)

Yet Canada got only 34 million people living there, whereas the European Union has 501,064,211 people.

No wonder Europe don't want any more migrants, the houses in Europe are also way smaller than Canada too!

[Fairtrade]

Britain has almost twice the amount of people than Canada, yet Canada is twice the size of the whole European Union. No wonder Canada allows more migrants whereas the Uk can really do with less.

[MelC]

With all do respect.... Canada is a BIG COUNTRY (more than twice the size of the European Union!)

Yet Canada got only 34 million people living there, whereas the European Union has 501,064,211 people.

No wonder Europe don't want any more migrants, the houses in Europe are also way smaller than Canada too!

hence my grandfather and his family, and possibly dash of salts grandfather being "brits" in canada ~ there were land grants, miners and Farmers, as mine was a miner bought up on a farm............

[hunpak]

My friend you indicated it as a joke but the fella is considering it..

and than he starts comparing Canada with Britain or EU.. im sorry sir i live in Britain and i can tell you things are way too stretched and no jobs. the recent election was won due to immigration policies of labour as immigration was never a serious issue 10 years back, but now u can find many parties who have one sole agenda and that is to kick out immigrants.

i want this world to be free of borders but that is only an idealist approach, the world is not matured enough and ideas such as EU are getting filed. look what happening in ur neighbouring country US, what do you say about the Arizona anti-immigration law. we need to be practical about these realities of life.

UK is massively cutting down its welfare system, i seriously worry that soon we won't have much left here.
taxes are so high, a average person earns 800 to 1000 quid and out of it 200 to 300 goes to tax and NI, and than accommodation is also 300 to 500 quid for a room only in a small house (700 quid plus for a 1 bedroom flat in zone 3 and 4 of london) and than u have to pay council tax which is also around 120 quid something (shared in case living with other people). after that u have to worry about eating, travelling etc (1 days travel card cost 7.50 something for london)...

and job is hard to find..

Regards

are u guys seriously advising him to cheat the system.. do u have any idea due to this cheating with system how much the genuine people have to go through.

the 2 "smileys" indicated it was a "JOKE"

as I have spent a YEAR YES A YEAR fighting to get my Non Eu spouse his entry visa that should have been issued within 4 weeks (as per directive)

and am still stranded in the Third country as the ferry comapny insist that his visa is tourist and he must comply with all schengen tourist regulations, our rental agreement is up here in the third country, our car has been here almost a year and once it goes over its "illegal" here and I will be fined, the DVLA now wnat my car to be permanently exported if I don't leave here within my "year", cahnces are that the accommodation and employment that were available in italy wont be by the time we get there IF we get there ~
No-one can tell me about how much "genuine" people have to go through, cos i could write a book!!

I would NEVER advocate illigal immigration NOR a "sham" marriage!

It was a joke! maybe i should have put this as there is no "sarcastic eye roll" which WOULD have been my first choice!

its always sad when people who genuinely want to emigrate do not fit in the neat little box, as their employment is not sought after or they don't have mega bucks in the bank!

[MelC]

[quote="hunpak"]My friend you indicated it as a joke but the fella is considering it..

and than he starts comparing Canada with Britain or EU.. im sorry sir i live in Britain and i can tell you things are way too stretched and no jobs. the recent election was won due to immigration policies of labour as immigration was never a serious issue 10 years back, but now u can find many parties who have one sole agenda and that is to kick out immigrants.

i want this world to be free of borders but that is only an idealist approach, the world is not matured enough and ideas such as EU are getting filed. look what happening in ur neighbouring country US, what do you say about the Arizona anti-immigration law. we need to be practical about these realities of life.

UK is massively cutting down its welfare system, i seriously worry that soon we won't have much left here.
taxes are so high, a average person earns 800 to 1000 quid and out of it 200 to 300 goes to tax and NI, and than accommodation is also 300 to 500 quid for a room only in a small house (700 quid plus for a 1 bedroom flat in zone 3 and 4 of london) and than u have to pay council tax which is also around 120 quid something (shared in case living with other people). after that u have to worry about eating, travelling etc (1 days travel card cost 7.50 something for london)...

and job is hard to find..

Regards


Hi there, Yes it seems DoS was giving it some consideration, thats why I looked for a "sarcastic eye roll" smiley, now it appears that DoS won't have to even think that way, and I hope he doesnt go down an illegal route, as I said, I wound NEVER advocate that.

and my reply was to you so that you would know that I would not advocate illegal immigration, even though it has taken over a year from inital contact with the embassy to get the visa, ~ worth having worth fighting for? and we have had to fight ever step of the way purely because frontline staff are either not informed, not trained, or told to obstruct ~ it has to be one of those 3!

I am a Brit, I know the cost of living there, its a lot cheaper where I am now, and I am not looking forward to the culture shock of cost of living as I get into the EU and eventually back to the UK, and I will miss living in the sunshine, but ony the sunshine, I long for the day when I can return "home" ~ to my england with all its flaws!

Too many people think the UK is the land of milk and honey, your very HONEST post tells them otherwise, that is the average wage for the most of the UK.

I doubt my views on immigration will be popular, its not a right to live in the UK its a priviledge, and should only ever be afforded to those with true intentions IMHO, but I do beleive people should be able to visit, and LEAVE at the end of that visit.

I have been a way a while, and I'm sure I will find many changes when I get back, and take them on the chin in true brit style, Home is where the heart is, and mine will always be with england in the end.

[avjones]

Luckily though I found out my grandfather was born and lived in Nottingham for 5 years. This means I can get a work permit very very easily now.

This really feels ridiculous though, how after one phone call I go from near impossible, to almost impossible to be rejected. Nothing about me changed, just some minor fact from a grandfather who dies before I was born. RIDICULOUS!

Not a work permit - an ancestry visa.

I did suggest you check out grandparents (-:

[Dash_of_Salt]

I only ever asked about my father's parents fleetingly. From him I was told they were both born here, but recently my aunt (his older sister) contacted me and told me otherwise; my grandfather was born in England and lived there until he was five.

Yes it is an ancestry visa, but they can be used for work and eventually naturalization the same way a work permit can. It's a different (and much easier) process but it'll ultimately arrive at the same place.

I also have the impression that most of the people replying to this post are from the EU. I understand you love the place, and that it is over-crowded, and that the majority are against immigration in some form. I love the place as well. Most western EU nationals have the ability to live and work on pretty much every continent. Canada is very similar, with one exception, that being Europe. I understand living in Europe is not a right, and I never claimed it was. It is a privelege, however it is an under-appreciated privilege and often the result of birth alone, something someone doesn't earn. I simply believe there should be a chance for a citizen of another first world country to earn entry, not have it made impossible right at step one (the work permit)

[avjones]

Much less stress than a work permit etc, you're right.

[hunpak]

I simply believe there should be a chance for a citizen of another first world country to earn entry, not have it made impossible right at step one (the work permit)

u r not being nice to 2nd world or 3rd world countries than? its their right too in case..