Immigration situation - advice needed

jenna11 · Post by **jenna11** » Mon Nov 15, 2010 9:22 am

Hi all, I am new to this forum.
I am looking for some advice. My partner is here illegally. He is from Morocco, he came here on a holiday to visit his brother and sister when he was 14 and he never went home. Both his brother and sister live here, both have children born in ireland and both work, so can I assume they are legal here?

How does my partner go about becoming legal here. We wish to get married next year - can he marry me while he is illegal here? and then this will grant him entry into ireland legally?

Apologies for all the questions, I am overwhelmed trying to help him. I understand he should not be here, he knows this aswel but equally he knows if he goes home he will never be able to come back here.He is a good, honest guy who has never been in any trouble with the law. He is here 5 years. I am an irish citizen, born here parents are irish etc. I am a student, I work part time also. Dont know if any of this information is needed but I am very very worried that i will loose my future husband and he will loose his life here.

Thankyou all for reading and if you can help me with any of this, I would appreciate any advice.

Jenna

Wisco · Post by **Wisco** » Mon Nov 15, 2010 10:12 am

I think you can get married, but I'm not sure if this will automatically grant him legal status here. Perhaps you can contact some of the groups listed in this forum that advises about immigration/residency rights?

jenna11 · Post by **jenna11** » Mon Nov 15, 2010 11:13 am

Thankyou for your reply - who is best to contact?

ciaramc · Post by **ciaramc** » Mon Nov 15, 2010 1:42 pm

Jenna - from my understanding even if you were to marry in Ireland... which is quite hard...if your partner has no documents he would still have to go home and apply for an entry visa in order to regularise his stay??? Have a look here....

http://www.inis.gov.ie/en/INIS/Pages/WP07000024

jenna11 · Post by **jenna11** » Mon Nov 15, 2010 2:24 pm

Thankyou Ciaramc, I appreciate your help!

He has no right to be in Ireland at the moment - so basically he will have to return to Morocco, apply from there for an entry visa ( what kind? )
and once he is here again we can get married? Then he can apply for residency here?

If we got married in Morocco, I wonder if it would have any legal standing here.

I know he is terrified of leaving Ireland, because his family is here. If he leaves and cannot get back in, I dont know what we would do.

ciaramc · Post by **ciaramc** » Mon Nov 15, 2010 3:10 pm

You would have to get married in Morocco...otherwise seriously doubt he would be able to get back in...even applying after marrying him it will be so difficult as his immigration history will go against him!

You are in a difficult situation but not sure how you can resolve it from Ireland! Also Morocco is quite hard to get a visa from...sorry I know it's not looking good....I'm married to a Moroccan so kind of know the system...the only difference is I have lived in Europe ....which as hard as it is to believe....if you apply for a spouse visa for another European country other than Ireland it would be much easier for him to get it....providing you are married or can prove a durable relationship!

Oh and your marriage would just have to be registered in the Irish emabassy in order to be valide in Ireland!

jenna11 · Post by **jenna11** » Mon Nov 15, 2010 3:37 pm

its a right minefield!! such a coincedence that you are married to a Moroccan!

So basically its off to Morocco we go to get married, then apply to live in an EU country and live there. With little chance of him getting back into ireland... great. my family are really gonna love this one!!!

Thankyou so much for your help. Which european country did you live in, can I ask? are some easier to gain entry into than others.
Sorry if the questions are too personal, just trying to get as much information as possible.

Do you think it would make a difference that his brother and sister live here, have children etc. They are working in big companies, so I would assume they are here legally, will find out for sure.

ciaramc · Post by **ciaramc** » Mon Nov 15, 2010 3:50 pm

Not sure his family connections will make a difference as he is classed an overstayer....which is so frowned upon....

Not a problem...right so if you get married in Morocco...and say live in the UK or even northern Ireland I think you can apply for what is known as a Family permit so he can join you straight away and also have the right to work!

And he can move back to Ireland with you...once you have exercised treaty rights...which I think is a minimum of 6 months...then he will apply from the Irish embassy for a visa joinbing EU spouse and he can come back with you! Saying that it will not be easy....make sure it is what you want! But maybe the only way to fix the situation!

I have lived in Italy for the past 10 years...married 5 with 1 daughter! My husband has been to Ireland with me...but believe me we didn't have it easy....he had a similar situation to your boyfriedns thankfully 10 years on and we are getting there and even possibly moving home to Ireland in the New year!

jenna11 · Post by **jenna11** » Mon Nov 15, 2010 4:34 pm

First up congratulations and I sincerly hope everything works out and that you will be able to move home together!

I am at the beginning of a college course that is 5 years in length but we were hoping to get married next year - I obviously cant do both if we cant live here so its something I will have to think about very carefully, as you say.

Can I ask what country you got married in?

For the moment I am just happy that it should be possible, it will take a long time and there are no garentees but hopefully it will work out, if we do things the right way.

What happens if he continues to live here and we just dont get married. Probably a silly question, but say we are living together here and have a child together, and immigration catches him - will he definately be deported, regardless of his child here?

Monifé · Post by **Monifé** » Mon Nov 15, 2010 4:53 pm

Jenna,

Do you possess any other EU citizenship?

If not, you could also move to NI for at least 6 months or more, work or do a course up there (if studying you need enough resources to support yourself and health insurance) which is called exercising treaty rights and then move back to Ireland under the Surinder Singh principle and you can apply for your partners residency under EU law then, which is much more lenient and negative immigration history should not affect their decision.

You could also try and marry in Ireland, my partner and I put our notification to marry in while he was illegal in Ireland, and then once married, you can apply for spouse of Irish national visa from inside Ireland, although this process can take 12 months or more, he will remain undocumented and prohibited from employment during this time and the negative immigration history could impact on the application as applications under Irish national law are at the "discretion of the Minister". But I do know of a few success stories of the above, where applicants were either a failed asylum seeker or illegally present.

jenna11 · Post by **jenna11** » Mon Nov 15, 2010 5:09 pm

Hi Monife,

I dont have citizenship of any other eu country, however my father is from london so I may have grounds to apply on this?

If we move up north and then come back down south under the surinder singh principle, do we have to be married or just partners?

If we apply to be married here even though he is illegal, is it likely that he will simply be deported? And if this happened, legally would it go against us if we married if we tried to move back here?

Thankyou for your help MonifÃ©

ciaramc · Post by **ciaramc** » Mon Nov 15, 2010 5:33 pm

Jenna....I'm sure you will be able to apply for british citizenship...on the basis of your father....also maybe you will not have to be married...if you can prove a durable relationship.....obviously if you have a child together is a good start...if you go the Irish route...it takes longer and no guarntees....obviously you have to think of your families needs...

BTW I got married in Italy......when it was still possible.....now you need to prove your immigration status!

ciaramc · Post by **ciaramc** » Mon Nov 15, 2010 5:35 pm

Oh....just back from Morocco....it is really beautiful....if you do eventually decide to marry there!

Thanks by the way...really hope we get back to Ireland in the New year! Heading back for Xmas anyway...Yay can't wait!

Monifé · Post by **Monifé** » Mon Nov 15, 2010 7:03 pm

jenna11 wrote:I dont have citizenship of any other eu country, however my father is from london so I may have grounds to apply on this?

If your father was born in london and is entitled to British citizenship, then you are also. That is the same situation as myself, although the DOJ refused my partners application for residency on the basis of my Irish citizenship, but we have issued high court judicial review proceedings, which if they go all the way, we might set a precedence which would count in your favour. They were wrong in their decision and we are challenging it. See my thread: Partners EU1 application refused on basis of dual citizen!!!

jenna11 wrote:If we move up north and then come back down south under the surinder singh principle, do we have to be married or just partners?

You can be both, whatever you wish. Being married makes the application easier, but as long as you have evidence that you have been living together for at least 2 years, then you can be just partners, having a child counts in your favour. Remember if you choose this route, to keep organised with your documents up north so that you can prove you exercised treaty rights there.

jenna11 wrote:If we apply to be married here even though he is illegal, is it likely that he will simply be deported?

Just submitting your marriage notification is not going to get him automatically deported, but if the registrar was to suspect your marriage was a marriage of convenience, he could notify the GNIB, although this is unlikely as you are a genuine couple.

If he gets deported at any stage, he faces a 5 or 10 year ban. If he gets the chance to leave voluntarily, jump at it, as this usually waives the ban.

Negative immigration history should not go against an application for residency under EU law although they do ask if the applicant has been deported in the form, but it shouldnt be refused on that basis only. Under Irish national law however, it is at the "discretion of the minister".

jenna11 · Post by **jenna11** » Mon Nov 15, 2010 7:32 pm

Thankyou both for all of your contributions - I will speak with my partner in the next few days and see what we will decide to do. We are both young so no major rush - unless a new law is coming in or something that will make it more difficult.

Best of luck MonifÃ© in the case, I will be sure to check the thread to see what the outcome is.

And to you Ciaramc, heres hoping you all will be in ireland in the new year.

Thanks again for all of your help, this forum is really great!

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Immigration situation - advice needed

Immigration situation - advice needed