EUFAM 4 Holder

[El shaddai]

On behalf of my collegue who is a family member of European Union.

1. Married in Ireland Nov 27 2007 and living in Ireland since then
2. Got Residence Card Sep 2008 Eufam 4 and will Expires Sep 2013.
3. Got 2 kids 2gether and happily living as couple.

The Question is when exactly can he apply for Permanent Residence and Naturalisation.
Thanks

[adlexy]

On behalf of my collegue who is a family member of European Union.

1. Married in Ireland Nov 27 2007 and living in Ireland since then
2. Got Residence Card Sep 2008 Eufam 4 and will Expires Sep 2013.
3. Got 2 kids 2gether and happily living as couple.

The Question is when exactly can he apply for Permanent Residence and Naturalisation.
Thanks

It depends

Was he "legally" living in Ireland at the point at which he got married in 2007? If not then, his legal right will be calculated from the date he was issued the EUFAM4 permit in 2008. I will assume that he would be qualified from sometime in Sept 2013.

If he is married to an Irish, he would have been qualified 3years after marriage.

[Obie]

Under EU rules, a residence permit is not constitutive of a right, but merely declarative. Therefore the issue of a Residence permit is only declarative in nature.

The effect of this is that your friend will qualify for PR in Nov 2012.

When he has secured PR, then i believe he can immediately apply for Citizenship.

It is difficult to see how the DOJ can then turn and say he has not accrued 5 years of lawful residence then, when they have issued a PR on the basis of 5 years lawful residence.

I am sure you get my gist.

However i must state the issue of Naturalisation falls entirely within the scope of national legislation. It will be difficult for such person to be refused in these circumstance, on the basis that they did not hold a residence permit for 2007, when their residence was lawful irrespective of it.

It can be argued that lawful residence is a different term from holding a residence permit.

[El shaddai]

@Obie, does that mean he can apply for permanent residence before the end of this year 2012? thanks brov

[Muttsnuts]

@Obie, does that mean he can apply for permanent residence before the end of this year 2012? thanks brov

Permanent residence is a separate application to EU FAM and you will have to show that for five years, you were both residnet and that the EU Family Member was exercising EU Treaty Rights for the entire 5 years. So to answer your query, your friend can apply in November 2012 but there is a high evidential onus on him to prove the foregoing.

[Obie]

@Obie, does that mean he can apply for permanent residence before the end of this year 2012? thanks brov

Yes it does.

The Justice Department offers a concession that people can apply 6 month before the expiry of their residence card. I don't think the same concession will apply to people whose RC validity is over 6 months, but have lived legally in Ireland in accordance with Community law. Therefore you will have a strong argument if the application is made in Nov this year.

To summarise, i believe you friend can apply for PR in Nov 2012, and afterwards can apply for citizenship immediately.

[El shaddai]

Thanks to every1 and i will get the info across to them.
God Bless

[IQU]

you can apply for permanent residence card before 6 months your current visa expiry.if it will approval you will get for next 10 years.good luck

[Sana786786]

Dear Friends Hello

I hope all is Well..
I also have bit similar condition on which you guys can give me advise.

I am British National and My husband is Non-Eu we got Married in Ireland July 2007 and living in Ireland since then But he Got his 5 Years Eufam 4 in August 2009. But the 2 years of Period after we got married from 2007 and 2008 he was not Legally in state ,

So i also have a Question that when exactly can he apply for Permanent Residence and Naturalisation. And his Permanent Residence card he can apply according to his Maaraige Cert Issued in 2007 or His Countdown starts from The time he got Stamped.. It is quite confusing , if u guys can Help ..

Regards's
Thanks
Sana

[Ben]

Hi Sana786786,

Your spouse will acquire the right of permanent residence on your fifth wedding anniversary, in July 2012. This is assuming that you are a UK national, that you will have exercised a treaty right for the five year period and that you and your spouse have been resident in the state for this time.

[Sana786786]

Yes i have been in ireland since i got married but here is one problem... From 2007 till 2008 for 1 year I was not employed , so will this 1 year gap effect ?

[Ben]

No. The employment activities of your spouse are immaterial. You, as the EEA national, need to be exercising a treaty right.

[Sana786786]

So it means He cannot Apply this year .. We have to wait for another 1 year

[Ben]

I see you edited your post after I replied.

What was the reason for your one year gap in employment and what were you doing for that period?

[Sana786786]

Ben , i was doing nothing , i had no job that time ... didnt applied for any social or benefits ...

[Ben]

Why did you leave your job?

[Sana786786]

Ben ur getting Confused,, in 2007 i got married in ireland and that time i was un-employed for 1 year and i got My job in 2008 till Now ....

[Ben]

Please complete the following:

• Date you arrived to live in Ireland.
• Date your spouse arrived to live in Ireland.
• Timeline of your activities in Ireland since your arrival until now.

[Sana786786]

Date i arrived to live in Ireland. ( May 2006 )
Date your spouse arrived to live in Ireland. ( May 2004) But he came on Student Visa that Time ..

We Got Married in Ireland ( July 2007) ....

I was Un-employed from 2007 till 2008 .. My first JOb i started was in 2008 Till Current Now...

[Ben]

What was your purpose of coming to Ireland in May 2006 and what were your activities between then and (month?) 2008 when you started your current job?

[Sana786786]

U cant see the purpose ive written above i came here to settle down with my Fiance in 2006 and God Married in 2007 ???

And Started Job in Mid of 2008 MAY or June !!!

[Ben]

I suggest you ask someone else.

[Sana786786]

Listen Ben, i dont know if ur in intention to help because u keep on asking me those questions what i have clearly mentioned above ... The reason of that 1 year gap ... .. its up to you if u want to help or not Rest i leave up to God .. he is the lord to show us a way.. Thakx for ur co-operation Ben and all others

[Muttsnuts]

Listen Ben, i dont know if ur in intention to help because u keep on asking me those questions what i have clearly mentioned above ... The reason of that 1 year gap ... .. its up to you if u want to help or not Rest i leave up to God .. he is the lord to show us a way.. Thakx for ur co-operation Ben and all others

If you were unemployed for the year in 2008 and you are the EU Citizen, then you were not exercising your EU Treaty Rights so you will not be in a position to apply on behalf of your spouse for Permanent Residency until you can show that for 5 years, you were exercising your EU Treaty rights. So if you were married in 2007 but didn't work 2007 and 2008, you may not be able to use that time as time for the PR application.

Basically, the thing to do is to apply from the earliest time from when you got married and you started working (or exercising your EU Treaty Rights in another way). Presuming you have remained in employment for 5 years with no significant gaps, then you should be able to apply for your spouse in 2013 for Permanent Residence under EU law. For Irish Citizenship, your spouse will need to show 5 years worth of Stamps in his/her passport.

[Obie]

I dont think the above statement is correct.

If the person was employed and then made redundant or they quit their work to engage in vicational activity related to their previous employment, then they still qualify as worker during their period of unemployment and cannot be considered as living in Ireland under conditions other than community law.

The question is , what was this woman doing in 2006 and if she was working, was she made redundant or not.